Author Topic: Have Build, Need Comment  (Read 6306 times)

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Offline sleepysheep

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #15 on: May 25, 2011, 04:30:31 PM »
Wow, thanks for all the input guys!

He's meaning that instead of 2 DUAL link DVI, the card will have 1 DUAL and 1 SINGLE -link DVI. The difference being the resolutions they can support, iirc.

Spot on!  Need the dual link to support 120hz.

Super helpful information!

Sleepysheep, THANK YOU for all of that!  I thought I would run into problems with the 'low' vram, but you've confirmed it.  Will take a bit longer to do with a bit of extra work, but might as well do it properly.  You raise a valid point in regards to the RAM as well, so I've adjusted it somewhat, new details are now below.

Mobo: Gigabyte GA-Z68X-UD3R-B3 Motherboard (http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=138_711_1183&products_id=17327)
CPU: Intel Core i5 2500K (http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=16531)
RAM: Corsair Vengeance CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 (http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=186_218_1125&products_id=16437)
GPU: Gainward GeForce GTX 580 3GB Phantom (http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=17016)

Also, how do you get on with cooling for the GTX 580?  I can imagine with two of them it would get rather toasty.  As the Palit ones aren't easy for me to get, and the Gainwards have a huge heatsink, I thought they might do nicely, although that will mean the top card won't have as much clearance as the second would be directly under it with the mobo.  My study is quite cool normally...

Also, you are paying a price premium on the Z68 boards, when they really do not perform any better than the P68 boards.  You will not be using the integrated gfx of the 2500k, so save yourself the money and get a good P68 board, the Asus P68 Pro is fantastic, have it myself.  Microcenter has been having sales on 2500k + P68 mobos for right at $300 combined.

Unfortunately I'm working off Australian prices, and in general it's priced higher.  And the best store we have doesn't do such combo deals.  And, the z68s aren't really all that much more bizarrely enough.  Thanks for the input!

The GTX 580 3gb, the heat sinks are good enough but barley. I'll be the first to admit my airflow in my case isn't all that great, and the cards can hit 80c quite easily expecially now it's getting warmer. Since 3d + triplescreen is going to eat Vram, my card might actually be the only thing with enough Vram. For MWLL 2gb will be enough, other games maybe not :) I can hit 1.7gb Vram quite easily playing MWLL on triplescreen, and thats without 3d!! And MWLL isn't the most demanding Vram game out there either.

I would highly recommend getting watercooling for the GTX 580, it's what I'm planning to do, or you can rip off the old heatsink and buy a really decent aircooling on each card. Remember any type of cooling effects GPU far more than a CPU.

When it comes to Ram, 6gb is the amount that I would say is perfect, 8gb gives you loads of breathing room. Ram is cheap, and it's ALWAYS best to get too much than too little. You will never need more than 8gb though.


One GTX580 will give you sweet perfromance on one monitor, and you should be able to overclock it to maxamize those frames. Sadly 3d + triplescreen is just too much for any other card out there, unless you like your settings on Low/medium.
Sandy 2500k @ 4.6ghz
GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 V1.0 - Worst Motherboard ever.
2x GTX 580 3gb
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Offline Ghogiel

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #16 on: May 25, 2011, 05:43:04 PM »
Ignore me about the 4GB, if you don't have to redirect funds around, and just increase your budget, which you have, then it's 8 all the way.  :P

Offline sleepysheep

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #17 on: May 25, 2011, 06:39:39 PM »
Ignore me about the 4GB, if you don't have to redirect funds around, and just increase your budget, which you have, then it's 8 all the way.  :P

LOL :D Couldn't you tell by the fact he was going to buy two top range cards that he wasn't on much of a buget ;) Hehe.
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2x GTX 580 3gb
8gb DDR3 dual channl 1600mhz
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Offline GB-72AT Talon

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #18 on: May 25, 2011, 06:49:59 PM »
And I 2nd the going for 8Gb RAM especially for MWLL.  More RAM means less OS reliance on hard drive cache means HUGE increase in system performance.  Invest in 2 x 4Gb of RAM now.  This leaves 2 empty RAM slots for later and consumes less power when compared to 4 x 2Gb of RAM.  It made a huge difference on my rig and I only did this recently.

8Gb is wasted on MWLL, just FYI, even in a Windows 7 x64 environment, it uses a whopping 2.5Gb system ram roughly maxed out + 1.3Gb max vram.  MWLL does fine with 4Gb

just FYI.  While i do agree with a single pair of sticks being used as opposed to four
True about the MWLL aspect (noting how I contradict my original post) but it does help over all system performance.  When I was running 4 Gb I would start up the task manager each time I wanted to play MWLL and kill a bunch of apps to get smoother performance.  Since I have recently upgraded to 8 Gb I no longer bother and MWLL runs smoother because the over all system runs smoother with W7 x64. 

Over kill on RAM is never a bad thing.  Especially if you do editing of any kind.  It will always be faster than hard drive caching.

I've only ever known one way of using a computer, and that's one main program at a time.  For instance I don't leave web browsers or other apps open when I launch MWLL.  Has nothing to do with how much memory I have and more to do with habit.  I started using computers back before "Windows" or the "World Wide Web".  4.7Mhz was a fast machine......my point is my habit is to close everything before running any game.  I know some people like to leave 10 apps running and don't want to stop those apps in order to game.  If a user wants to do that they should get 8Gb of ram, might as well. 



Sure it felt different but so did my wife after the kids were born. A little loose but it still gets me off every time. -- Suspect

Offline Ghogiel

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #19 on: May 25, 2011, 07:05:22 PM »
LOL :D Couldn't you tell by the fact he was going to buy two top range cards that he wasn't on much of a buget ;) Hehe.

He was originally looking at a dual FAN 570. 2 gpus weren't in the initial budget. If it was that would change things.

Offline Vanion2

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #20 on: May 25, 2011, 07:52:39 PM »
I've only ever known one way of using a computer, and that's one main program at a time.  For instance I don't leave web browsers or other apps open when I launch MWLL.  Has nothing to do with how much memory I have and more to do with habit.  I started using computers back before "Windows" or the "World Wide Web".  4.7Mhz was a fast machine......my point is my habit is to close everything before running any game.  I know some people like to leave 10 apps running and don't want to stop those apps in order to game.  If a user wants to do that they should get 8Gb of ram, might as well.
I'm right there with you 100% on this statement. 

By killing apps I was referring to "background" apps (IE AMD's CCC.exe, java updater, the audio control software that duplicates the W7 audio control, etc).  Now it's not an issue since combined they took up around 500Mb of RAM when you compare that to 8 Gb with typically 6.5 Gb of unused memory available before launching MWLL.  Sure...8 Gb is over kill but RAM is so cheap right now the difference in price between 4 Gb and 8 Gb was $25 at the time I was shopping (prices have gone up again right now) for comparable memory.  You can still pick up an 8 Gb - 2 stick pack for just under $100 US today and that's still a heck of a lot cheaper than it was 6 months ago.

Offline sleepysheep

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #21 on: May 25, 2011, 09:38:38 PM »
I've only ever known one way of using a computer, and that's one main program at a time.  For instance I don't leave web browsers or other apps open when I launch MWLL.  Has nothing to do with how much memory I have and more to do with habit.  I started using computers back before "Windows" or the "World Wide Web".  4.7Mhz was a fast machine......my point is my habit is to close everything before running any game.  I know some people like to leave 10 apps running and don't want to stop those apps in order to game.  If a user wants to do that they should get 8Gb of ram, might as well.
I'm right there with you 100% on this statement. 

By killing apps I was referring to "background" apps (IE AMD's CCC.exe, java updater, the audio control software that duplicates the W7 audio control, etc).  Now it's not an issue since combined they took up around 500Mb of RAM when you compare that to 8 Gb with typically 6.5 Gb of unused memory available before launching MWLL.  Sure...8 Gb is over kill but RAM is so cheap right now the difference in price between 4 Gb and 8 Gb was $25 at the time I was shopping (prices have gone up again right now) for comparable memory.  You can still pick up an 8 Gb - 2 stick pack for just under $100 US today and that's still a heck of a lot cheaper than it was 6 months ago.

Well Talon, I'm not saying thats a bad habit to get into. It's just these days you don't have to care :D

I never close anything down unless I know I will not want to read or do anything with it for the rest of the day lol. Sometimes I have over 25 pages in IE open with loads of other things running in the background of just random stuff I've done or started. Crazy, but we all have our habits :D

I'll agree, that if you close everything down, and literally run your system as efficent as possible you will probably get away with 4gb of Ram. But if it's only a few extra bucks so you don't ever have to worry or care, well, personal preference :D
Sandy 2500k @ 4.6ghz
GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 V1.0 - Worst Motherboard ever.
2x GTX 580 3gb
8gb DDR3 dual channl 1600mhz
HX 1000W Corsair
Win 7 x64 Home Edition
5970x1200 Or 1920x1200 Triple Screen 26" Monitors
Dx10 Max settings 16xAF 8xAA

Offline sleepysheep

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #22 on: May 25, 2011, 11:59:10 PM »
I just got around to installing metro, (Yes I only buy games to see how pretty they are alot of the time ;) ) and well....




It hit over 2.5gb of Vram! And this was only near the start of the game, in enclosed buildings and tunnels, in open areas thats only going to go up!!!

And remember this is WITHOUT 3d lol. Mind you my FPS is terrible, max settings my FPS doesn't even manage 30fps, isn't playable, (I will of course lower the settings but this was to see how pretty it looked, it's not overley pretty if your wondering, but Phyx looks good) so you can see how 2gb of Vram is not enough for triple screen, but it is enough for MWLL. And if I thought my 20fps was bad, if I only had 2gb of Vram, it would be 1-5fps....If only I had a better CPU....

Anyway, thought it would help you decide what card to get ;)
Sandy 2500k @ 4.6ghz
GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 V1.0 - Worst Motherboard ever.
2x GTX 580 3gb
8gb DDR3 dual channl 1600mhz
HX 1000W Corsair
Win 7 x64 Home Edition
5970x1200 Or 1920x1200 Triple Screen 26" Monitors
Dx10 Max settings 16xAF 8xAA

Offline (TLL)martinroshak

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #23 on: May 26, 2011, 05:14:21 AM »
Ignore me about the 4GB, if you don't have to redirect funds around, and just increase your budget, which you have, then it's 8 all the way.  :P

LOL :D Couldn't you tell by the fact he was going to buy two top range cards that he wasn't on much of a buget ;) Hehe.

Ahahaha, yeah.  Well, I have a goal, and that goal is triple screen surround gaming with the ability to also do it in 3d.  If the GTX 580 fits that bill and nothing else does, this uni student is just going to have to work harder  ;D

Will do it in two or three stages now I think.

First will be the complete mobo/cpu/ram and probably gpu upgrade.

Second will be the second gpu and more powerful psu.

Third will be the third 120hz screen (I'm using Alienware ones).

Mmmm... expensive hobby!

Been looking at packing some extra fans as well to try and keep up with the heat load.  There is a sidepanel for my model of case that allows me to put in two additional 140mm fans but it is proving hard to track down, the local lian-li/lancool supplies don't seem to have it...  Planning on installing another 140mm induction fan in the front as well, bringing it to a total of six 140mm fans and one 120mm on the back.  If I was to get the side panel for fans, would it be preferable to have them drawing air in, or pulling it out?

I've only ever known one way of using a computer, and that's one main program at a time.  For instance I don't leave web browsers or other apps open when I launch MWLL.  Has nothing to do with how much memory I have and more to do with habit.  I started using computers back before "Windows" or the "World Wide Web".  4.7Mhz was a fast machine......my point is my habit is to close everything before running any game.  I know some people like to leave 10 apps running and don't want to stop those apps in order to game.  If a user wants to do that they should get 8Gb of ram, might as well.
I'm right there with you 100% on this statement. 

By killing apps I was referring to "background" apps (IE AMD's CCC.exe, java updater, the audio control software that duplicates the W7 audio control, etc).  Now it's not an issue since combined they took up around 500Mb of RAM when you compare that to 8 Gb with typically 6.5 Gb of unused memory available before launching MWLL.  Sure...8 Gb is over kill but RAM is so cheap right now the difference in price between 4 Gb and 8 Gb was $25 at the time I was shopping (prices have gone up again right now) for comparable memory.  You can still pick up an 8 Gb - 2 stick pack for just under $100 US today and that's still a heck of a lot cheaper than it was 6 months ago.

Well Talon, I'm not saying thats a bad habit to get into. It's just these days you don't have to care :D

I never close anything down unless I know I will not want to read or do anything with it for the rest of the day lol. Sometimes I have over 25 pages in IE open with loads of other things running in the background of just random stuff I've done or started. Crazy, but we all have our habits :D

I'll agree, that if you close everything down, and literally run your system as efficent as possible you will probably get away with 4gb of Ram. But if it's only a few extra bucks so you don't ever have to worry or care, well, personal preference :D

I'm exactly the same.  Once upon a time I had over forty tabs open in firefox, itunes open, watching video files, outlook open, skype open, transferring files and flicking between more than five word documents... I am also one of those people...

And, Metro is a crazy crazy game bringing a SLI setup to its knees, just crazy!

Thanks for the convincing sleepysheep.  If you were single screen gaming, the gtx 570 would be the better option price wise, as the performance jump compared to price jump between the 570 and 580 isn't too impressive.  But, for multi-screening, makes perfect sense!  Bye bye any chance of a girlfriend for the next couple of years, lol!
Laptop | M11x R1 | C2D U7300 @ 1.6ghz | 4gb DDR3 | GT 335M 1gb | Seagate Momentus XT 500gb Hybrid | Razer Orochi | Razer Kabuto

Desktop | Lancool Dragonlord PC-K62 | Corsair HX-650 | C2D E7400 @ 2.8ghz | 4gb DDR2 RAM | 500gb Seagate 7,200rpm | XFX HD 5770 1gb | 2x Alienware OptX 23" 3D HD Monitor | Logitech X-540 Speakers | Alienware TactX Mouse | Alienware TactX Keyboard

Offline sleepysheep

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #24 on: May 26, 2011, 12:25:48 PM »
Metro is one of the most demanding games currently out, in the world, when it comes to your GC. Yet it doesn't look God like, I was a bit disapointed.

Crysis Warhead is very very optimized, the fact it is one of the only games I can run on max settings on triplescreen with good fps, just shows how much effort Nvidia (And I assume ATI) have put into making the game work really well.

And yes it's a very expencive hobbey as I've found out too lol. Hurts the bank.

And you brought alienware monitors, lol OUCH, jees, that was an expencive mistake lol. Bit late now lol.
Sandy 2500k @ 4.6ghz
GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 V1.0 - Worst Motherboard ever.
2x GTX 580 3gb
8gb DDR3 dual channl 1600mhz
HX 1000W Corsair
Win 7 x64 Home Edition
5970x1200 Or 1920x1200 Triple Screen 26" Monitors
Dx10 Max settings 16xAF 8xAA

Offline ratbuddy

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #25 on: May 26, 2011, 02:03:25 PM »
The Alienware 120hz monitors were fairly priced at release and were a better option than the other 23.6" 120hz option available at the time.

+1 to buying 8GB RAM.

-1 to the guy who suggested "P68" because there is no such thing. He meant P67, and the only person who would suggest P67 today is the guy who wants to feel better about his own purchase. H67 for budget, Z68 for enthusiast. P67 is pointless.

Offline sleepysheep

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2011, 02:54:44 PM »
The Alienware 120hz monitors were fairly priced at release and were a better option than the other 23.6" 120hz option available at the time.

+1 to buying 8GB RAM.

-1 to the guy who suggested "P68" because there is no such thing. He meant P67, and the only person who would suggest P67 today is the guy who wants to feel better about his own purchase. H67 for budget, Z68 for enthusiast. P67 is pointless.

When I see the word Alienware, I just read, expencive as hell. If it isn't then fair enough.
Sandy 2500k @ 4.6ghz
GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 V1.0 - Worst Motherboard ever.
2x GTX 580 3gb
8gb DDR3 dual channl 1600mhz
HX 1000W Corsair
Win 7 x64 Home Edition
5970x1200 Or 1920x1200 Triple Screen 26" Monitors
Dx10 Max settings 16xAF 8xAA

Offline (TLL)martinroshak

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2011, 02:57:05 PM »
Yeah, Alienware peripherals aren't quite as ridiculous as the desktops. Got the two screens for 845 AUD all up, and couldn't be happier! Mouse and keyboard had a smidge of a premium, but I felt it was worth it :)

Thanks for the confirmation on z68, after a little research I thought it would be better. In summary, why is it better than p67? Also, I thought the z68 boards had integrated display outputs, but the board I've selected doesn't seem to, contacted the seller to seek some clarification but I thought this was a standard feature of the z68 platform?

Thanks for all the discussion and info, very helpful!
Laptop | M11x R1 | C2D U7300 @ 1.6ghz | 4gb DDR3 | GT 335M 1gb | Seagate Momentus XT 500gb Hybrid | Razer Orochi | Razer Kabuto

Desktop | Lancool Dragonlord PC-K62 | Corsair HX-650 | C2D E7400 @ 2.8ghz | 4gb DDR2 RAM | 500gb Seagate 7,200rpm | XFX HD 5770 1gb | 2x Alienware OptX 23" 3D HD Monitor | Logitech X-540 Speakers | Alienware TactX Mouse | Alienware TactX Keyboard

Offline (TLL)martinroshak

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #28 on: May 28, 2011, 01:46:47 PM »
Decided to change RAM to some G.Skill Ripjaws with lower latency and higher voltage (1600mhz 7-8-7-24 1.6v), will these be better than the Corsair Vengeance Sticks (1600mhz 9-9-9-24 1.5v)?  The latencies, even after much googling, have me confused.
Laptop | M11x R1 | C2D U7300 @ 1.6ghz | 4gb DDR3 | GT 335M 1gb | Seagate Momentus XT 500gb Hybrid | Razer Orochi | Razer Kabuto

Desktop | Lancool Dragonlord PC-K62 | Corsair HX-650 | C2D E7400 @ 2.8ghz | 4gb DDR2 RAM | 500gb Seagate 7,200rpm | XFX HD 5770 1gb | 2x Alienware OptX 23" 3D HD Monitor | Logitech X-540 Speakers | Alienware TactX Mouse | Alienware TactX Keyboard

Offline ratbuddy

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Re: Have Build, Need Comment
« Reply #29 on: May 28, 2011, 03:21:47 PM »
1.6v is getting up near the limits of the SB memory controller. I'd just stick with the 1.5v stuff to be safe, even though the timings are slightly worse. You'd never be able to tell the difference anyway.