Author Topic: Mechlab: In-game and standalone  (Read 1387 times)

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Offline =CJW= Zweistein000 (W)

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Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« on: January 30, 2012, 01:57:51 PM »
So before you go This again, let me tall you that this kind of implementation could probably give us the most of what we wanted from mechlab and could quell many of  the fears that are present about mechlab.

The ideas is to create two different mechlabs: one limited version, that can be accessed in-game, when you enter a mech bay, and one that you can use to preset your variants, before you connect to a server (or even launch MWLL). Thought this may seem double the work for the same results (and it basically is), this can bring the best implementation of mechlab to MWLL. And IMO if I survived 2 years without mechlab, I can survive another 2 without it.

In-game mechlab:
This one would be a limited version, following a bit stricter rules than the one for MW4. Battlemechs will only be able to change their weapons within the same type (energy for energy, missile for missile, ballistic for ballistic) or remove them and change them for heatsinks (remove SRM2 for a single DHS,...). You will be unable to mount new equipment or to change your arm form energy to ballistic. You will also be unable to change the amount of armor and it's type, type of engine and engine rating or internal structure. Similar thing would apply for omnimechs but due to the nature of omnimechs, they would be able to exchange between types of weapons and add/remove electronics. Internal structure, Engine,... will still be limited. Though this will give Clan and omnimechs and advantage I recommend that because omnies require different supply lines than battlemechs, omnimechs only get this liberty at Main  mech hangar and be unable to refit in single mechbays (in TC) or that refits at single mechbays cost additional C-Bills for omnimechs.
No one should be able to refit in field repair bays.

Standalone Mechlab:
This would be a totally free mechlab, the kinds you see in CBT. Everything is permitted (boating makes your mech cost skyrocket). This will allow us to see some exciting refits, but they should be priced accordingly (mounting a Hunchback  mk.2 with 2x Gauss, Mounting MRM 20 on the arms of warhammer, Making atlas run at 80 kph for ultimate assault scout mech XD, quad gauss Fafnir :o ,...). The only limit would be your imagination, the in-game cost (you can create a mech that costs 400 000 C-bills, but will you ever be able to use it) and the number of variants you can take in-game (so we dont overflow the server with 12673421963493123 variants  :P , I would recommend around 10 variants per player, and everyone has access to stock variants).

What this does is enable the full refits of mechs and vehicles, but it also overcomes the problems we saw in MW4, where you could take 60 min (or more) to fully reconfigure your mech. If you need to quickly adapt to a situation in battlefield, you take one of your preset chassis, maybe change a weapon here and there and go, you don't spend 60 min: replacing the standard engine with XL, changing the ERPPC to LBX-10, removing 10 DHS for 15 HS, changing the 12 tons of STD armor to 14 tones of Stealth, adding LAMS and GECM, removing MASC and JJ and wondering if you should change that 1.5 tones spare you have to 2 tones for armor or should you add more armor, another weapon, or should you add AECM over GECM or maybe don't change that ERPPC at all and change...

P.S. When I say Battlemechs and omnimechs, the same goes for all the vehicles, not just mechs.
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Offline =CJW= Dhalrin

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2012, 02:56:47 PM »
Not having played MW4 Multiplayer I was not expecting ML to be an in game thing at all. I cringe at the thought of running out in a TC map, capping the first base, only to find I'm the only one out of base, because my team is happily configuring their mechs?!

Offline =KoS= Eldragon

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2012, 03:13:23 PM »
Not having played MW4 Multiplayer I was not expecting ML to be an in game thing at all. I cringe at the thought of running out in a TC map, capping the first base, only to find I'm the only one out of base, because my team is happily configuring their mechs?!

^ This. x10^∞

I have nothing against the OPs ideas, they are a good one, I am just really pessimistic about human nature.  I have enough frustration with half my team standing around in-base as it is.

Offline =CJW= Zweistein000 (W)

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2012, 03:50:14 PM »
Not having played MW4 Multiplayer I was not expecting ML to be an in game thing at all. I cringe at the thought of running out in a TC map, capping the first base, only to find I'm the only one out of base, because my team is happily configuring their mechs?!

^ This. x10^∞

I have nothing against the OPs ideas, they are a good one, I am just really pessimistic about human nature.  I have enough frustration with half my team standing around in-base as it is.

That's why I recommended a very limited mechlab for in-game use.
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Offline Kelmola

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2012, 03:56:42 PM »
Umm... didn't MW4 let you save your custom configs, and then simply let you choose them instead of stock variants in the drop screen? At least this is how I remember it...

Online Spooky

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2012, 04:42:34 PM »
I would have expected the Mech Lab in MWLL to be in-game, but not usable while you are connected to a server.

Offline Az

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2012, 05:46:51 PM »
That's why I recommended a very limited mechlab for in-game use.

That's why everyone else recommends no mechlab for in-game use.

Anyway:

We are still determining the functionality and requirements for the MechLab.  Due to the way that asset variants are stored, it may not be feasible/possible to have dynamic, user-customised variants introduced during runtime, thus necessitating an "offline" MechLab application only.
 
Assuming that both an offline and an integrated "online" MechLab option were possible, the development team will choose one path.  Doing otherwise would require that the codebase for the MechLab be maintained in two separate locations, with two separate storage methods, which would derive no real benefit.

I don't really care if the mechlab is in-game (but "offline") or a standalone application, but I'd rather not have to quit and re-launch the game to apply changes. However this might not even be technically possible. Let's forget about swapping weapons on the fly.

Offline =CJW= Zweistein000 (W)

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2012, 06:53:23 PM »
We are still determining the functionality and requirements for the MechLab.  Due to the way that asset variants are stored, it may not be feasible/possible to have dynamic, user-customised variants introduced during runtime, thus necessitating an "offline" MechLab application only.
 
Assuming that both an offline and an integrated "online" MechLab option were possible, the development team will choose one path.  Doing otherwise would require that the codebase for the MechLab be maintained in two separate locations, with two separate storage methods, which would derive no real benefit.

Somehow I missed that :P Never mind then. Just wanted to give us the best of everything.
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Offline Knightcrawler

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2012, 08:21:39 PM »
I hate to say this, but even if people had a little ability to customize, they'd waste so much time in the mech hangar. Sure there'd be people who'd know after they died "Okay, I want an Uller B but with this weapon and a free ton instead," but most players won't do that in their head.

Offline xDeityx

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2012, 08:24:43 PM »
Yep.  As Eldragon said, people already thumb-ass it in base way too long with the limited decisions they have now (I am reminded of the Sinbad standup where he bitches about people taking a while to pick from the McDonald's menu that hadn't changed in decades).  If you vastly increase the number of decisions available to the player while in the hangar (by letting them customize gear on the fly) it would be very bad for the public scene.
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Offline The Thing }12thVR{

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2012, 08:28:18 PM »
McDonald's menu that hadn't changed in decades

my McRib™ would like to have a word with you.

Offline xDeityx

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2012, 08:30:45 PM »
"Out of every 100 men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the One, One is a Warrior, and He will bring the others back." --  Heraclitus

Offline The Thing }12thVR{

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2012, 08:41:35 PM »
Thats what we need! Pictures in the buy menu instead of text.

Offline Squibby

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2012, 10:03:42 PM »
Yeah, a definite no to a in-game mechlab. I don't want my entire team sitting around 'customising' their mechs. Let them do that offline.

As Leer mentioned (back in 2010, I might add) from a technical standpoint it's harder to get a dynamic in-game one running. I think the most feasible one would be a seperate application (similar to the action mapper), not particularly fancy looking that allows you to set up what pods and weapons are equipped to which hardpoint, change armour levels (within certain limits), change heatsinks and add / remove equipment.

Once the design is validated and ok'd it gets saved into a custom slot accessible from the buy menu in-game. Each player would have say 5-10 slots. To prevent hacking variants, the custom config file would need to be verified on-line too.

Offline Nemo

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Re: Mechlab: In-game and standalone
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2012, 02:53:58 AM »
Each player would have say 5-10 slots.

Per mech right? I gotta have my elrm 20 quad uac2 twin light gauss mauler and my hgauss quad sxpl twin mrm 20 mauler, oh and my twin mrm 40 twin lxpl quad er small laser mauler, oh and...