Author Topic: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream  (Read 2988 times)

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Offline Warlord Kentax

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Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« on: September 01, 2014, 06:43:43 AM »
Well, the work's already been done, right? I mean, all the mechs we have today followed a set of build rules. They were being kept secret for some reason, I can't remember why, but I think it was a good reason. Now that development has been suspended indefinitely, maybe it would be a good time to release the build rules for the mechs. I want to fantasize about what the schizo hammer could have been. I want to make a fafnir with 10 AC2s or a Thanny C that makes up its mind between lasers and flamers or a Master and Commander with AECM instead of GECM.
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Offline Chezzar

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2014, 10:55:12 AM »
Yes, The Narc cougar with ImporvedJJ and GEGM. For this I would swap the CERLarge Laser for a CERmedium. And I would try to bring back the Chevy with the light gauss and the LRM 5.

Offline Silvercraft

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2014, 11:23:33 AM »
I think they were released.   :o

Edit:
Is this what you are looking for http://forum.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php/topic,18852.15.html or am I missing something here?
« Last Edit: September 01, 2014, 11:31:05 AM by Silvercraft »

Offline Warlord Kentax

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2014, 10:18:49 AM »
Thanks Silvercraft.

That thread doesn't seem to have any info about why I can't put a UAC 20 on a raven. Or put an Hgauss on an Osiris. There is some sort of size limit on each part of the mech. For example: the Atlas can have an AC20 in the torso, but not on its arms. I don't see these rules anywhere.
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Online Spooky

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2014, 01:05:04 PM »
Thanks Silvercraft.

That thread doesn't seem to have any info about why I can't put a UAC 20 on a raven. Or put an Hgauss on an Osiris. There is some sort of size limit on each part of the mech. For example: the Atlas can have an AC20 in the torso, but not on its arms. I don't see these rules anywhere.

There was also a PDF released that may answer some of those questions, but I can't find it at the moment.

Offline Defender

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2014, 09:05:08 PM »
Thanks Silvercraft.

That thread doesn't seem to have any info about why I can't put a UAC 20 on a raven. Or put an Hgauss on an Osiris. There is some sort of size limit on each part of the mech. For example: the Atlas can have an AC20 in the torso, but not on its arms. I don't see these rules anywhere.

No idea where that build rules document is. Leer might know. I thought he provided it, or I did, sometime shortly after the final patch. I still have the whole build on my PC though.
Otherwise, some of the pod limitations are for gameplay or even aesthetic purposes. Some mechs looked completely retarded with an assault-size pod on some of the lights for example.
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Offline Fatal1st

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2014, 11:33:32 PM »
That's the one I was referring to.

Offline xInVicTuSx

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2014, 02:14:31 AM »
Because those are assault pods and those mechs can't hold assault pods. The Uller can though because of its Gauss, so technically you could see an LBX20 or UAC20 on its arm... we never did though. Not sure why?

Sometimes pod sizes would get weirdly inconsistent and there was some changing of minds several times on what would get approved and what wouldn't. Keep in mind that even with all the limitations that were put on, gayassscrubmechs were still perfectly build-able and we simply spared you all from them. I myself personally vetoed a planed Dual Gauss JJ Catapult. :P
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Offline Warlord Kentax

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2014, 03:26:25 AM »
Still nicer than MWO's quad 4 PPC catapult.

So generally I should just look at the existing mechs to see what sort of pods they have?

Also, I don't fully understand the difference between a pod and a slot.

That PDF doesn't appear to list which weapons are what size or how many spaces each one takes up.

I miss the ELRM Raven.

I think I heard that there was an Uller with a UAC20 for a little while in some alpha build.
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Offline Starch1ld

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2014, 05:38:49 AM »
In next patch I want 9xCERPPC Daishi like in MWO.  :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PL4tGI9YsIQ&list=UUaO4yKW29-7ZOGzm2fb6_nQ

Offline xInVicTuSx

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2014, 05:39:32 AM »
Well for instance, a madcat's ear is a mount for a pod, you can put a missile pod on it, a large or assault weapon, or a triple pod of medium weapons like lasers. The Mauler on the other hand has very restricted slots, you can put missiles in those torso slots but nothing else, while the arms need large or assault weapons (though i might have put some medium lasers in the arms once instead?) It doesn't matter whether they be energy or ballistic. While the four nipple cannons used to be small weapons only, I asked that they be upgraded to medium slots and it was granted, thus the UAC5 mauler and the 4 ERMBL mauler.

While the Fafnir for instance MUST have at least assault ballistic weapons in its two main cannons, nothing less. I put some Tbolts in them and it was awesome. But then everyone vetoed it.  :'(

Its pretty much the reason the x4 L.gauss had to go cause the Lgauss is a large weapon.

Every mech has its own set of rules really. We would have to go through them one by one to explain it all and there are still some things that are grey areas where we had multiple devs asking each other thinking someone else knew. I personally wanted large weapons on the partisan but I think it was vetoed due to it only being allowed medium weapons, thus the disappearance of the L.Gauss partisan. Note that pod "sizes" don't really apply to missiles, if it can hold missiles it can pretty much hold any kind of missile launcher as long as it doesn't look completely retarded. Thus the MRM shiva has lrm15 launchers? rather than LRM20 even though it has MRM40s and 30s because the LRM20 launchers looked stupidly huge.

Defender is right in that the rules are just as much for aesthetic reasons as for balance reasons, the mech needs to LOOK plausible.

I recall multiple calls for the canon Novacat with the 6 LRM-15s but there was no way to make that not look totally retarded.
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Offline Warlord Kentax

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2014, 07:27:59 AM »
The Rifleman B shoulda had some lasers instead of 2 AC:5s.
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Offline Defender

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2014, 08:15:34 PM »
Well for instance, a madcat's ear is a mount for a pod, you can put a missile pod on it, a large or assault weapon, or a triple pod of medium weapons like lasers. The Mauler on the other hand has very restricted slots, you can put missiles in those torso slots but nothing else, while the arms need large or assault weapons (though i might have put some medium lasers in the arms once instead?) It doesn't matter whether they be energy or ballistic. While the four nipple cannons used to be small weapons only, I asked that they be upgraded to medium slots and it was granted, thus the UAC5 mauler and the 4 ERMBL mauler.

While the Fafnir for instance MUST have at least assault ballistic weapons in its two main cannons, nothing less. I put some Tbolts in them and it was awesome. But then everyone vetoed it.  :'(

Its pretty much the reason the x4 L.gauss had to go cause the Lgauss is a large weapon.

Every mech has its own set of rules really. We would have to go through them one by one to explain it all and there are still some things that are grey areas where we had multiple devs asking each other thinking someone else knew. I personally wanted large weapons on the partisan but I think it was vetoed due to it only being allowed medium weapons, thus the disappearance of the L.Gauss partisan. Note that pod "sizes" don't really apply to missiles, if it can hold missiles it can pretty much hold any kind of missile launcher as long as it doesn't look completely retarded. Thus the MRM shiva has lrm15 launchers? rather than LRM20 even though it has MRM40s and 30s because the LRM20 launchers looked stupidly huge.

Defender is right in that the rules are just as much for aesthetic reasons as for balance reasons, the mech needs to LOOK plausible.

I recall multiple calls for the canon Novacat with the 6 LRM-15s but there was no way to make that not look totally retarded.

Pretty much this.
Much of the design was relatively arbitrary for all intensive purposes, though it was based on common sense, balance, aesthetic value, and a general consensus.

Just because something's possible didn't make it right.
Hence Leer's Flying Fafnir made it through the cracks, but we nerfed Toth's Light Gauss Fafnir, so you can see where we had a difference of opinion at times.
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Offline Warlord Kentax

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Re: Release the Build Rules, Let Us Dream
« Reply #14 on: September 05, 2014, 12:20:30 AM »
LT gauss faf shoulda had 1 LT gauss in each arm and something else in the torsos.
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