Author Topic: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition  (Read 4820 times)

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Offline StrOf10kBabies

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Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« on: November 13, 2016, 12:20:01 AM »
Title says it all. Some of us want to see a return of the pre-patched Novacat B (one with the clan 4x large pulse lasers), Fafnir with the RAC5s, and the Vulture B variants. Perhaps add them into the next patch with price spikes for balance. Would like to also see more mechs that utilize energy boats instead of all this missile and auto cannon variety.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2016, 04:16:34 AM by StrOf10kBabies »

Offline Warlord Kentax

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2016, 12:58:41 AM »
Title says it all. Some of us want to see a return of the pre-patched Novacat B (one with the clan 4x large pulse lasers), Fafnir with the RAC5s, and the Vulture A variants. Perhaps add them into the next patch with price spikes for balance. Would like to also see more mechs that utilize energy boats instead of all this missile and auto cannon variety.

Vulture A is the Gauss Vulture and it is the same in 071 and 080.

Fafnir with RACs isn't too important to get back since Mr. Bubbles Atlas is a way-way cheaper alternative with a standard engine instead of XL that is better except for the lack of 2x LAMS.

The dev team prices mechs based on a flat chassis price for each different mech/tank/whatever and then an added price of each piece of equipment and each weapon. All prices are calculated. The only way to increase the cost of a single variant of a mech is to change the weapons or equipment on it.

4 cLPL Novacat with MASC was awesome. I was sad to see it go and I've asked several times for it to be put back in. Especially since pulse lasers just got buffed in this patch. Hopefully it will be in the next version.
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Offline Xesle

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2016, 01:09:49 AM »
I agree it does seem that in 0.8 there are alot more assets carrying autocannons than there were previously, especially amongst the lighter categories of both the weapon itself and assets.  I barely see any of them (like the Osiris B and G, Ravens B F and G, Solitaire B, Uller E, Pumas A and G, Shadowcats F and G, Black Lanners E and F, and Ryoken E) being used because frankly I just don't think they're good configurations and were shoehorned in for the sake of diversity. 

I think the best example of this is the Osiris G, which carries an ERPPC, two AC2s, and an LRM5.  Its as if the designer was just going down a checklist to ensure that this variant had one of each type of weapon.  The result is a clusterfapp that nobody uses and the same is true for alot of the other new variants of 0.8. 

I'm not necessarily arguing for the return of stuff like the old Vulture B (speaking of which I can't help but wonder why that's gone but we still have an only slightly nerfed quadruple LRM boat vulture), but I'd rather have fewer variants that are actually good and compelling for the players to use than tons of crappy ones that nobody will use like the ones I've listed above.  Diversity of variants shouldn't be more important than the variants themselves actually being fun to use.

And because this is a variant discussion thread, no post from me will be complete without also whining to have the pre-0.7 Vulture A back.  Bring back the RAC5 demo too.

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Offline Mech Daddy

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2016, 01:33:36 AM »
It's sad to see the RAC demo and Racnir gone, but for most of it I can say the new assets feel more fun than the old ones (maybe because its fresh). Give me a Masakari with ER Larges / Pulses and/or LRM while at it.

Offline Warlord Kentax

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2016, 02:57:07 AM »
I think the best example of this is the Osiris G, which carries an ERPPC, two AC2s, and an LRM5.  Its as if the designer was just going down a checklist to ensure that this variant had one of each type of weapon.  The result is a clusterfapp that nobody uses and the same is true for alot of the other new variants of 0.8.

I just used that Osiris yesterday. Standard AC2s are so much better now. Even a single ERPPC is good on almost any mech and an LRM5 is icing on the cake. Every time we have TSA Snowblind it's my starting asset.

Also, AC2s are BA murder machines. They just go *splat* even at 1200m.
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Offline Sxooter

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2016, 07:48:35 AM »
Yeah ac2/5 are brutal to ba.  At any longer distance the mgs are useless against BA due to divergence, but the concentrated death in that short stream is impressive. Some bigger mechs have 4ac2. set them on chain fire when face by ba.

That Osiris is useful but can't brawl.  But it can stand off at 899m meters and print money. I expect once the lolc3 is properly nerfed that it might be a good choice late game when you can hang back and avoid damage while pitching in.

Offline cest73

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2016, 11:25:44 AM »
Wait to see the (unofficially announced) Owens G with ERLBL+LBL replace the twin LBL one  :o
Being just 2k c-bills more expensive than the old one it will well fit within the starting assets (i double checked)

Yes @Xesle the Yeomen is really making the Vulture B obsolete:
I used it in a tunnel on some earlier tenderized heavy mechs and got quite an massacre (!in a tunnel!) while getting to repair even...

The 0.8.0 cLRM update really redefines the clan assets now.

Offline HAARP

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2016, 07:03:46 PM »
I sort agree on the smaller ACs. We have a ton of token black guyAC2/5 variants.
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Offline Stahlseele

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2016, 08:11:52 PM »
Problem being that you can not really do right by the smaller calibre AC <.<
'any kind of discussion of randomness ALWAYS WILL EQUATE to being able to critically hit a mech's reactor by firing a micro beam laser while facing 80 degrees to the side, shooting the ground, which would cause a random explosion which would randomly crit his entire team's reactors which would randomly cause the server itself to explode which would randomly generate a strange quark which would randomly hit the earth and randomly randomness randomfapp the shit fapp random!'
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Offline Mech Daddy

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2016, 08:59:17 PM »
AC2/UAC2 sucks yeah... LB-2X is kinda ok (at least right on start with that one chevy). Buff pls, need my fix of dakka.

Offline Stahlseele

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2016, 02:25:17 AM »
No, you literally can not do anything to AC2 and AC5 to improve them, without me becoming horribly OP with them again.
There used to be a time, when i alone could, in a quad AC5 Partyvan, both shut down the entire relevant airspace on a map AND also shear off the heads of Atlas Mechs.
Because back then, the AC5 had a much lower reload time, much higher projectile speed and actually used the missle code as far as i know.
Which means it created a more or less constant stream of explosions with screenshake on target.
And it did not have as much projectile drop either, in addition to the increased actual projectile speed.
THAT was when the AC2 and AC5 both were still usefull weapons. Nowadays, no, they are not.
And if you think about it, you will understand why:
A QuadAC5 setup means you have an AC20 that has less bullet drop, faster bullet speed, MUCH faster firing rate.
Yes, that is horribly OP. And to make that not be the case, they had back then already, had to change ACs to the sorry state they are in right now.
And surprise surprise, shortly after that change suddenly came a time of Air-Asset-Dominance, because both the Partyvan AND the Huey suddenly could not provide adequate AA anymore.
'any kind of discussion of randomness ALWAYS WILL EQUATE to being able to critically hit a mech's reactor by firing a micro beam laser while facing 80 degrees to the side, shooting the ground, which would cause a random explosion which would randomly crit his entire team's reactors which would randomly cause the server itself to explode which would randomly generate a strange quark which would randomly hit the earth and randomly randomness randomfapp the shit fapp random!'
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Offline RDL_Vitos

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2016, 04:13:43 PM »

And surprise surprise, shortly after that change suddenly came a time of Air-Asset-Dominance, because both the Partyvan AND the Huey suddenly could not provide adequate AA anymore.


Offline Xesle

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2016, 06:01:50 PM »
I thought that ac2 and 5 use bullet code?

Prodigal son my ass.

Offline Mech Daddy

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #13 on: November 14, 2016, 09:25:42 PM »
I thought that ac2 and 5 use bullet code?
Yep but his point p much was that the damage they do is @$$
I feel that UAC5 are ok though. Havent touched normal AC5. Uac2 is sad even when you have lots of them (that one Daishi), havent touched Ac2 and I can expect it to be much worse.

Offline Stahlseele

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Re: Revert back some of the old mech builds in Community Edition
« Reply #14 on: November 14, 2016, 09:34:56 PM »
I thought that ac2 and 5 use bullet code?
Yes, now they do, but that wasn't always the case.
'any kind of discussion of randomness ALWAYS WILL EQUATE to being able to critically hit a mech's reactor by firing a micro beam laser while facing 80 degrees to the side, shooting the ground, which would cause a random explosion which would randomly crit his entire team's reactors which would randomly cause the server itself to explode which would randomly generate a strange quark which would randomly hit the earth and randomly randomness randomfapp the shit fapp random!'
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