Good Ol' Medium Laser

[=KoS=Zeus]

More or less this was Multiplayer Battletech 3025. It was fun, until you realized that 4 medium lasers would absolutely cut a mech in half. If they had implemented a non-pinpoint targeting reticule then it would have had more promise, but translating everything but the random hit locations is a BAD BAD idea because this is where a majority of the weapon balance is actually located, random locations. This is why an AC/20 is brutal, even though it weighs 4x as much as 4 medium lasers that do the same amount of damage. One weapon hits and obliterates a single location, the others scatter damage across the target.

Also, look at the Solaris VII rules before you completely disagree with alternate weapon reload/recharge times, they did it there first.

[SeniorBiscuit]

Yeah exactly, the system would need a fairly unforgiving cone of fire, that would have to sort of translate to the hit\miss percentages from the board game, and then be innaccurate enough to prevent all your weapons from hitting the same place untill brutally short ranges, at which point id be fine with 4 medium lasers cutting a mech in half.

Id probably give all players a gunnery rating of  3 or 4 for judging percentages...

And yeah Ive read the about the solaris rules, with like 3 sub turns wasnt it? Some fire 3 times per 'turn' other only get one shot ect. In alot of ways I prefer a slow recycle time for all weapons though, goes back to making EVERY shot count...

[=KoS=Zeus]

good luck firing your medium lasers every other turn and not overheating though. Just because you could fire them more often in Solaris VII, didn't mean you should. Remember that in those rules the weapon heat and heat scale is quadrupled while the heat sinks remain unchanged. Your mech may have 12 heat sinks and 4 medium lasers, but if you don't stagger fire them, then you are building up 48 heat in the first salvo, and only dissipating 12, the following round you dissipate another 12, and are still at 24 heat. The third round you fire again, and build up another 48 heat putting you to 72 heat, the 12 heat sinks kick in and drop you to 60, putting you into a situation where you might shutdown and your machine is frying hot.

It really added a lot of complexity to the game, and gave you opportunities to cut and run to cool down, or push the red and fire off another salvo and hope your ammo didn't cook off.

[SeniorBiscuit]

Sounds like a good basis for a mechwarrior game then, Im not too experienced with the rules set so I can't formulate an informed opinion on the matter.

[DoA]

Alas for 3025, we have clans in this game:

3049: Clans invade the Periphery, contact established with the Clans, Operation Revival takes place.

I hate to say it, but its rather hard to balance a Timberwolf against anything 3025, I seem to recall somewhere back in the vaults of my brain was this paraphrase:

It combined a catapult and a marauder and managed to move 33% faster!

If we really want to argue apples to apples and oranges to oranges, we would need to know the time frame of this game. Just glancing at the weapons load out in some of these default configs, its going to be at the very least 3050, if not later.

So back on topic, the Good Ol' Medium Laser, if we are anywhere close to the simulation style of game play, was a great weapon, however looking at the pods idea, (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRvqRHszJho) it seems that if we will be limited in the sheer number of weapons mountable, which leaves the mlas to be relegated to a secondary roll.

Thats my 2cbill and if anyone can correct me, I would love to hear it!

[SeniorBiscuit]

I know MWLL isnt set in 3025 mate, I know my battletech history, disturbingly well sometimes.

Im just dreamin...

Youll still probably to be able up to 12 medium lasers on a single mech quite easily, 3 in each arm\shoulder slot, like the twolf for example.

[=KoS=Zeus]

Potentially up to 16 on a Timberwolf. 3 in each shoulder pod, 3 in each arm, and 2 on each side of the torso.

That leaves 11 tons for extra heat sinks for a total of 26 double heat sinks (52 heat dissipation), and an alpha strike which produces upwards of 80 heat, 2 shy of instant shutdown. Of course, the design also delivers a staggering 112 damage in a single blast, vaporizing 7 tons of armor instantly.

[DoA]

I agree, on a Timberwolf you probably will be able to do that, however, on a 50 ton mech (such as a Hunchback) there probably will not be enough mount points to swap out the ac20 for the tonnage equivalent in mlas.

<-- just misses btech and mw2's ability to mount where you would like though I fully understand the game limitations!

[xInVicTuSx]

Swapping Ballistics for laser spam? nooooo.
I hope boating wont be a huge issue with this, I mean it would be great to fight a Black Hawk or Nova Cat with that kinda laser weaponry, but if people start doing that with everything it would kinda be lame. I always liked the idea of having certain mechs be made for lasers, different internal structures that handle heat differently. That way no matter how many heat sinks you slap on a mauler for instance, it would never have the same heat management potential as a novacat. That's why the lava levels in games always intrigued me, it served to negate some of the double heatsink spam effectiveness and made for more interesting fights.  Also, I personally liked the MW4 pods that limited you to a certain type of weapon for a non omni spot, it really made more sense (wiring and structure wise).
I hated in MW3 how you could just slap any thing you wanted anywhere on any old mech and get away with it.
About lasers themselves though, I've actually found that Large Lasers are worth their weight in heat lately. I used to always swap them for ER's and add more heatsinks, but the heatspike control for normal Large Lasers is very useful. As for Medium Lasers, that's a tougher sell over ER's imo, they're only good enmasse when they have that short of range. Ala Kodiak for example.

[Uranium - 235]

Agreed, the ability to just throw LRMs on your feet like in MW2 was ridiculous. You can put different missiles on an F-15, even put 'utility' things on the pylons, but it would take thousands and thousands of man-hours to manage to make it carry a second internal gun. And it would be impossible to make it carry those guns on the tips of the vertical stabs - there's simply no way to get the ammo there. Point is, there's limitations on what you can put where.

I can see variants like the all-laser Hunchback coming out of factories that way, but not simply being wired up on the fly.

Besides, wasn't the entire point of Omnimech technology that you HAVE this flexibility?

[=KoS=Zeus]

Hurray for people that see the light of what MW4 and now MWLL is doing for weapon mounting and pods. I personally would like to see the IS be more restricted in this situation with more hard mounted weapons than clan mechs, but that's probably just me.

The real answer to whether people boat or not is going to come from answering how weapon groups are going to work. Is it in my best interest to single fire each weapon so I have the best chance of landing consecutive shots in a single location, or will firing a big group all hit the same location? So far, what I've heard, is that the weapons have a cone of fire, and so even a tight group of 3 ER Medium lasers, like on the Timber Wolf B, will probably criss-cross and hit different parts of an enemy mech with a single trigger squeeze. This makes me happy as it promotes pilots being smart about weapon locations and layout for their mech, it also encourages heat management since it will take time to accurately fire all your weapons rather than popping out for a half second, alpha striking, and then backing up behind cover.

[(TLL) Heretic]

Of course, if say an 8 damage point laser took 2 seconds to discharge fully then you'd have those 8 points spread over a moving targets surface, pulse lasers would take less time to discharge (and recyc faster) for less damage and range, bingo: problem solved 

[Chucky]

More or less this was Multiplayer Battletech 3025. It was fun, until you realized that 4 medium lasers would absolutely cut a mech in half. If they had implemented a non-pinpoint targeting reticule then it would have had more promise, but translating everything but the random hit locations is a BAD BAD idea because this is where a majority of the weapon balance is actually located, random locations. This is why an AC/20 is brutal, even though it weighs 4x as much as 4 medium lasers that do the same amount of damage. One weapon hits and obliterates a single location, the others scatter damage across the target.

Also, look at the Solaris VII rules before you completely disagree with alternate weapon reload/recharge times, they did it there first.

Battletech 3025
Oh how I miss that little mech with 4 med lasers, till it got nerfed and the game got run into ground. Curse you EA!!!

[DarkRavin]

So in short.... I think I'll be stacking Reflective Armor