Author Topic: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl  (Read 12892 times)

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Offline RoninShooter

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2010, 03:48:19 PM »
A Question for all you mapping buffs out there.

People are obviously always going to want city maps. And the dev's response is usually "Better start making assets then" (Or the fact it'd be too laggy)

But is there anything stopping people from making a "Virtual Reality" City map? One where the "Buildings" are essentially smooth-textured blocks? If you've played the Metal Gear Solid VR missions you'll know what I mean.

Point is, even I could create a cuboid in some 3D editor or other, so it's not going to be a matter of "Too much time to make" - but would it cause significant lag?

And if it would, at what point would it not? A small map based on 5v5 could be used in leagues, but could be -much- smaller than, say, Clearcut.

I would say as seminoob, that it would be possible with the solids in sb2 to make a nice city map, but it would be hard texture work.^^ (Glasses, Doors and so on)

Offline Alexander

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2010, 04:28:00 PM »
No need, thats the point xD

Of course you could slap on textures and just have perfectly flat blocks that actually looked like buildings,

But my idea was more along the lines of having blocks that are the size and shape of buildings... but look like some kinda stylised "VR Wireframe" type thing.

Think Tron, but with Mechs :3
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Offline UN1T

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #17 on: January 14, 2010, 04:58:26 PM »
I cant see why not ...the only thing you have to be wary of would be long straights of streets..since this game is horrible at rendering over 1000meters (DX10 change the way we play..bollocks i say)
Blanko  , im wondering , that canyon test you did , is that the full size ? map ?  as your at a decent hieght and yet can view all the textures renderd perfectly fine ?  ..is there a button im missing ? as the moment i pull any more then 100 metres away the terrain goes to "smudge" mode and is ewww
« Last Edit: January 14, 2010, 05:08:34 PM by D416 »
2 IS Commanders having a chat.

IS Commander 1 : What Clan Mech weigh's 200 ton , with the top speed of a snail and has 70 tons of weapons & armor ...?
IS Commander 2 : No idea .....but i propose we nuke the SOB from space & move on to the next planet.

Offline UN1T

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2010, 06:48:22 PM »
Haha ..my 10 minute city map.










After doing this at 2am ..ill look more into it when im more "alive/awake" it seems easy enough ..and if you got access to 3dmax ..you can export them out and in ..so ..easy i guess if you know how.
2 IS Commanders having a chat.

IS Commander 1 : What Clan Mech weigh's 200 ton , with the top speed of a snail and has 70 tons of weapons & armor ...?
IS Commander 2 : No idea .....but i propose we nuke the SOB from space & move on to the next planet.

Online KorJax

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2010, 09:26:55 PM »
The problem is, we would want to make a quality made city map and not just a quick 10 minute arena with blocks.  Something that's actually a real city (and would look good in a real portfolio :P)

There's a big difference between having a city map with lots of solid art assets, visual design, and more versus having a VR space with blocks.

Remeber that MGS didn't have the whole game level desiged based around VR - only the "training" was.  A full multiplayer level wouldn't be appropriate as a VR scenario in the way the mod is designed and intended.  Especially since why would vehicles, mechs, etc not be "VR-ized" but everything else would be?

Offline ~SJ~ Tajin Nevversan

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2010, 10:11:07 PM »
Hmm hmm I guess it depends on the type of city. Even if it's not VRized, a city that mainly consists of big buildings and skyscrapers wouldn't need that much detail. Combined with some natural Elements (building the city around a mountain or something similar) and such things as parks... then it might feel bigger than it really is.

Just some thoughts. A low visual range could also help, bad weather maybe. A citymap in a thunderstorm would be awesome. :)

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Offline Blanko

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2010, 10:27:11 PM »
im working on a tropics map and i got 1 major question.
the aero spawn spot / hanger ...is obversly slaved to either IS or Clan...but ..i want to put the aero hanger in the middle of the map ..and have it as a neutral ..buy zone..so any one can can buy an aero or vtol.
Creating 3 major points of conflict ..
1st    : ppl will fight localy to hold the opposing team back from the aero dome to deny them air support.
2ndly : to force ppl to play  / coordinate better as you cant have 14 pilots..or you will loose the aero dome..
3rdly : pilots will be less inclines to kamakaze after running out of ammo and just respawn back at the aero dome .

So in effect im nullifying some major complaints about Aeros / VTOLS ( IE : buy plane ... let loose with weapons ..kamakze ..buy new plant..rinse and repeat ) and giveing ppl an objective to do in a TDM game enviroment.
So ...is it possible to make the Aero Dome a Neutral entity ?
Also ..if i can ..id like to place 2 Domes  one containing VTOL and the other Aero ...so i can split the 2 teams up across the map to fight over these 2 major conflict points.
So can they be edited to only supply 1 type of aircraft ? or is it hardcoded and to much work to lock down a catergory ?


Correct me if I'm worng, but I think this sounds like mod all in itself. I'm pretty sure you would have to program that via the lua gamerules script. Of course I'm not a porgrammer, so I could be mistaken.

Offline Alexander

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #22 on: January 14, 2010, 11:15:22 PM »
(and would look good in a real portfolio :P)

Haha, I get ya  ;)

The question was more based on personal interest rather than a request to have it included in the mod - Originally asked because way back when I used to play Mechwarrior alot... I joined Clan Wolf, and was given my Trial of Position in what was effectively a "VR City" arena :3

Destroyed all three enemies, too  ;D
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Offline UN1T

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #23 on: January 15, 2010, 01:41:45 AM »
im working on a tropics map and i got 1 major question.
the aero spawn spot / hanger ...is obversly slaved to either IS or Clan...but ..i want to put the aero hanger in the middle of the map ..and have it as a neutral ..buy zone..so any one can can buy an aero or vtol.
Creating 3 major points of conflict ..
1st    : ppl will fight localy to hold the opposing team back from the aero dome to deny them air support.
2ndly : to force ppl to play  / coordinate better as you cant have 14 pilots..or you will loose the aero dome..
3rdly : pilots will be less inclines to kamakaze after running out of ammo and just respawn back at the aero dome .

So in effect im nullifying some major complaints about Aeros / VTOLS ( IE : buy plane ... let loose with weapons ..kamakze ..buy new plant..rinse and repeat ) and giveing ppl an objective to do in a TDM game enviroment.
So ...is it possible to make the Aero Dome a Neutral entity ?
Also ..if i can ..id like to place 2 Domes  one containing VTOL and the other Aero ...so i can split the 2 teams up across the map to fight over these 2 major conflict points.
So can they be edited to only supply 1 type of aircraft ? or is it hardcoded and to much work to lock down a catergory ?


Correct me if I'm worng, but I think this sounds like mod all in itself. I'm pretty sure you would have to program that via the lua gamerules script. Of course I'm not a porgrammer, so I could be mistaken.

was just asking ? ..lol ..just incase it is something rather simple...you never know unless you ask.
other wise ill shelve it and continue with my 2 mech maps (yes ..NO VTOL/AERO) until i can think of a way to make pilots work for thier steads instead of wham , bam , kamakaze, rinse and repeat.
2 IS Commanders having a chat.

IS Commander 1 : What Clan Mech weigh's 200 ton , with the top speed of a snail and has 70 tons of weapons & armor ...?
IS Commander 2 : No idea .....but i propose we nuke the SOB from space & move on to the next planet.

Offline UN1T

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2010, 03:12:04 AM »
messing will some solids in my Test City map.

2 IS Commanders having a chat.

IS Commander 1 : What Clan Mech weigh's 200 ton , with the top speed of a snail and has 70 tons of weapons & armor ...?
IS Commander 2 : No idea .....but i propose we nuke the SOB from space & move on to the next planet.

Offline UN1T

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2010, 06:26:03 AM »
have hit a snag ...the objects iv been building are no longer "solid" and you can pass through them .
fellas want to lend a hand and tell me what ive screwed up ?

edit : never mind ..i forgot to hit " reset Xform"
 /faceplam
« Last Edit: January 15, 2010, 06:33:43 AM by D416 »
2 IS Commanders having a chat.

IS Commander 1 : What Clan Mech weigh's 200 ton , with the top speed of a snail and has 70 tons of weapons & armor ...?
IS Commander 2 : No idea .....but i propose we nuke the SOB from space & move on to the next planet.

Offline Draks

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2010, 06:48:47 AM »
Speaking of city maps... what happened to Coldsteel? Was the map completely scrapped or is it just sitting waiting for assets and other work?

Offline UN1T

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #27 on: January 15, 2010, 08:32:52 AM »
8 hours of me learning  solids  , glass and prefab building.
I made a mono rail station , tracks and rails.
Ill solve the stupid texture painting later.
Found a great place with nice high res building textures..but alas...havent been successful at importing them.
I guess ill be trawling the interwebs later tonight for answers.

Breakable glass


Untextured station


pans of glass and station.


be nice if we could some how get all the map builders who are "making there own city maps" to some how share textures and prefabs with each other.
as it is..im at a lost as to were the hell all my prefabs are being stored.
Well.im off to work ..chow ppl ...
if my attempt at map building is an eyesore "kiss my ass" , your welcome to help   ;D
2 IS Commanders having a chat.

IS Commander 1 : What Clan Mech weigh's 200 ton , with the top speed of a snail and has 70 tons of weapons & armor ...?
IS Commander 2 : No idea .....but i propose we nuke the SOB from space & move on to the next planet.

Offline [MPB]OM_Sannyasi

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #28 on: January 15, 2010, 09:04:51 AM »
a little something for a solids city. I made a castle out of solids a long while back and probably used OVER 9000!- actually i dunno how many i used but when you get over a certain amount when you go in game only a certain amount will show up and the rest are yellow balls (they all work fine in the editor). i solved this by extracting something from the level.pak folder (forgot what exactly). but this made the autodownloader in wars not work. try to use brushes and crysis assets whenever you can or you might end up with the same problem I had- was never able to release that nifty map kuz of that =/


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Offline CHHš Siege

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Re: MWLL Map Builders Pub Crawl
« Reply #29 on: January 15, 2010, 12:22:21 PM »
Note one of the issues that I know the mapmakers for this mod have struggled with: the urge to make the terrain, etc., huge. When working with a mech model as a scale, to make things of a "normal" relative proportion makes them huge. What you wind up having, though, is an issue where from the player perspective your mech doesn't really feel all that big. In the examples above, you wouldn't necessarily have to remove/rescale all/most of your buildings, but at the very least you'd need to populate the rest of it with a large number of smaller, more normal sized buildings like a real city - even in the future - is likely to have. This is what will also force the in-fighting people are looking for, as the people who are asking for these maps almost certainly want to feel like they are walking in a mech through a futuristic version of the big city nearest to them. Numerous 100m to 200m tall "modern" skyscrapers, and a large number of traditional height buildings less than 100m tall forming the majority of the city streets and blocks. This creates rolling canyons of building tops for mechs to shoot over, alleys they can shoot down but not fit through, etc., etc., etc.. You've got a decent start there, but you really need to keep human scale, not mech scale in mind, so that when you're in a mech you really feel like you're riding high in a big honking walking war machine, not a tiny tin can in a massive metal termite mound.

One of the reasons the devs and everyone says "start modeling" in response to a request for an urban map is that as a team looking to do a proper release, they aren't planning on doing any half-rendered maps. I don't discourage you from doing what you're doing there and wish you success in your project, but for the poster who queried "why not", it's a matter of pride to produce something polished and gleaming and new, and this really is still a beta, guys. It's so beta it's almost an alpha, but the community had been kicking and screaming and whining and begging for so long that they finally got the beta they couldn't live without. Great things are yet to come in this mods development, and if you had any idea of the scale and scope of what they've overcome thus far to get it working, you'd be astounded, as well as looking forward to see what they do in the next year or two. Besides, given the volume and intensity of the posting on the maps that came in the beta as it was, I can't imagine the complaints and insults that would have come up had the team actually released the game with a map in a Tron-like state.



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