Rewarding Scouts with C3

[(TLL) Heretic]

I think we should reward scouts with C3 for their efforts by giving them a small reward every time they detect an enemy unit who is not on any of their teams radars without the C3 feed. 

A mechanic like the Crysis Radar Scanner reward (IIRC you got 5 points per detection vs 100 for the kill) could be modified, it seems only fair that a Scout with C3 should be rewarded for these detections as they help a team immensely.  There should be a "cooldown" timer on the reward to stop abuse (such as the Scout going active/passive multiple times in a short period to get rewards from the same units multiple times); and to reward Scouts who relocate an enemy who has slipped away to repair and arrived back.

I also think it follows logically that if a friendly does damage to a target that it would not otherwise have detected without benefit of a Scouts C3 link (such as in most LT counter barrages), then the C3 Scout should receive a portion of the damage reward like the TAG and Narc; but reduced to say a quarter to a half of the Narc/TAG rewards, as there is no skill involved for the Scout other than finding the target.

I don't see many folks taking a C3 unit when there's heavy or assault 'mechs on the field (arguably when they are most needed), a reward system for Scouts might change this a little.

[Clownmite]

Interesting idea. The scout could get a few c-bills per second that the enemy unit is on radar, or get a slightly larger one-time bonus.

It could be difficult to determine if the enemy unit wouldn't have been detected without the scout though. Say the enemy unit gets detected by the scout, and a friendly brawler mech moves in to engage. By the time it's in range, it doesn't need the C3 to detect the enemy in radar - so does this count as the C3 mech helping or not?

[(TLL) Heretic]

Interesting idea. The scout could get a few c-bills per second that the enemy unit is on radar, or get a slightly larger one-time bonus.

It could be difficult to determine if the enemy unit wouldn't have been detected without the scout though. Say the enemy unit gets detected by the scout, and a friendly brawler mech moves in to engage. By the time it's in range, it doesn't need the C3 to detect the enemy in radar - so does this count as the C3 mech helping or not?

No, in that case there should be no reward; a reward for damage would only apply to LT really, I can't think of any other unit that would qualify.

[sgnl05]

This is cool. I'd also like to see a BF2 style spotting mechanic (aim at enemy and press button to show him on radar for a brief period of time) with a small c-bill or xp bonus associated with it. It's annoying flying a hawkmoth and trying to be a spotter when you have to take your hands of the flight controls to type "enemy owens D6", especially since by the time you're done typing the owens has usually moved to another grid location.

[SquareSphere }12thVR{]

This topic gets a big "thank you!"  definitely need something to get people to scout more effectively especially in late game.

[Nitro_R]

Excellent idea.
Spotting for heavy mechs is a crucial role.

And spotting for Enemy Longtoms would allow more co-ordinated attacks on them.

[(TLL)Siilk]

Interesting idea. The scout could get a few c-bills per second that the enemy unit is on radar, or get a slightly larger one-time bonus.

I like "cbills over time" idea. It encourages constant information update, not quick ping and retreat scouting strategy and minimizes abuse possibilities.

It could be difficult to determine if the enemy unit wouldn't have been detected without the scout though. Say the enemy unit gets detected by the scout, and a friendly brawler mech moves in to engage. By the time it's in range, it doesn't need the C3 to detect the enemy in radar - so does this count as the C3 mech helping or not?

As long as enemy's not on brawler's scanners by his own powers, scout has a reward.

[(TLL)Sky_walker]

Wouldn't this just provoke mounting C3 on every single mech when the Mechlab will be out? Cause if I would get free Cbills without combat than I'd put C3 wherever I can.

Other than that - great idea!

[~SJ~ Xarg Talasko]

Mechlab Electronics package hardpoints :p

[~SJ~ Blhurr]

I really wanted to can the answer, "C3 will shine in competitive play.  Leave it alone and develop other priorities." But after thinking about it for a minute I'm going to have to agree with the OP.  Teambased roles always get the shaft in competitive gaming and usually relies on the altruism of the players to get their proper due.  This, I think, is a mistake in the long run.  The challenge of course is, "how do you balance a non-combat role in a combat based merit system?"  Non-damage roles like the APC and Scout mechs need some loving when it comes to measuring their effectiveness.  They are like the offensive line in football.  The QB gets all the press but would get flattened without good blockers.

[(TLL) Heretic]

Wouldn't this just provoke mounting C3 on every single mech when the Mechlab will be out? Cause if I would get free Cbills without combat than I'd put C3 wherever I can.

Other than that - great idea!

Hopefully the C3 will be restricted to 'mechs that are Lights and a few specialist Mediums in the MechLab. But most of the Mediums we have been promised are line and support  'mechs.....

*dreams* the 55ton Men Shen (The Ravens big brother) would be the perfect Scout in MWLL http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Men_Shen

I managed to grab a game on Sandblasted yesterday with 30mins left to go, most people were in mediums and heavier 'mechs but I stayed in the ELRM Raven the entire match, made 150K providing support (which bought a team mate an Assault) , and punishing 2 LT -1 kill 1 Bail - (they take almost a full ton of ELRMs but it's worth it as when engaged they run around rather than aiming at our guys) they did not even know I was there.  Ended  as SCL with 4-0 ratio, and a satisfied feeling that I had contributed to our dominance over the enemy. I particularly enjoyed chasing after Defenders APC (he had just joined and I believe his plan was to park up behind our hanger to harass and delay our reinforcements thus helping to break the siege on his base), thanks to the C3 his wild ride dodging ELRMs and Mguns over the dunes ended with a Thanatos welcoming party

I included this little anecdote to show that a Scout can play effectively in a heavier match and still make money (Although that cash came with about 6 RTB for reloads), you just have to work harder to stay out of one-shot death from the Heavier machines while getting as close as possible.  It's actually a very fun role to play as you switch between hunter and rabbit constantly, but a little cha-ching of 100-200 C-Bills for sniffing out the enemy would make it pretty much addictive and have more folks doing it IMHO.

[Bowrrl]

Well... C3 in MWLL basically functions as a C3i in Battletech, which weighs 2.5 tons.

Things that weigh 2.5 tons:

5 SBLs or 2 MBLs and 1 SBL (Also goes for Heavy or ER Lasers)

AECM or BHP, with .5 tons to spare

BAP or GECM, with 1 ton to spare

LAMS with 1 ton to spare or AMS with 2 tons of ammo.

8 rounds of Heavy Gauss ammunition, with .5 tons to spare

And much more.

If someone wants to throw C3 on everything they have they can be my guest. Chances are that they won't have some of the stuff I mentioned because of it. And if they do, they have sacrificed something in order to gain that extra tonnage.

[~SJ~ Blhurr]

Yes but relative tonnage on a light vs assault chassis is dramatic in that regard.  One always considers the C3 advantage the sole purview of the 'scout' mechs.  I suppose, however, that it's the speed of the scout mechs in combination with C3 that is the real pairing.  Having a scout mech at point and a couple of out-rigger mechs on either side really gives you a keen view of the battlefield.  If one of these mechs is an assault mech well you stand a really good chance of losing them to a javelin swarm of faster opponents whereas a scout mech can retreat back into cover or repair from light damage.

I can't wait for bigger maps.

[(TLL)Sky_walker]

Actaully - C3 on assaults have it's point too - friendlies will know how many opponents rush you and they will try to help. Also imagine - if everyone have C3 than when you spawn you can check the mechs enemy have, how many of them, how far from the base, and pick up the best layout as well as best path towards the target. Amazing advantage.

2 tons is much, sure, but some mechs have it spare in this case or another, so it'd be more a matter of taking additional ammo or asking teammate to bring APC on battlefield.

Providing intelligence (so increasing team effectives) and gaining free Cbills would refund all the losses.


As of C3 for light-mechs only - this could solve all the problems.
Only... what about BT variants: C3 Atlas, C3 Catapult, C3 Rifleman?

[(TLL) Heretic]

Actaully - C3 on assaults have it's point too - friendlies will know how many opponents rush you and they will try to help. Also imagine - if everyone have C3 than when you spawn you can check the mechs enemy have, how many of them, how far from the base, and pick up the best layout as well as best path towards the target. Amazing advantage.

2 tons is much, sure, but some mechs have it spare in this case or another, so it'd be more a matter of taking additional ammo or asking teammate to bring APC on battlefield.

Providing intelligence (so increasing team effectives) and gaining free Cbills would refund all the losses.


As of C3 for light-mechs only - this could solve all the problems.
Only... what about BT variants: C3 Atlas, C3 Catapult, C3 Rifleman?

You got me thinking, and it'd be cool in the MechLab (when we get it) to have no restrictions on C3 and see how that goes, my gut tells me that only the faster units are really going to benefit from carrying it.

Should ASF be allowed to mount it? (Would be quite lucrative in a fast fighter)