Battle Value Tables

[Defender]

I found this hardcore PDF, I'm not sure if anyone has referenced this before but it's awesome because it has actual costs per-unit of like...a bajillion Battletech units.

Chekkit.



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[xKamikazex]

Oh wow, what a wicked table. This is an excellent find D. Very nice!

[Defender]

Yeah, it's pretty damn snazzy.
Looking at those numbers, I had an Idea for balancing unit costs.

I'm not sure how you're doing costs per unit, balancing unit cost for unit type, salvage, and kill rewards.
I had an Idea though.

Say, since the numbers are so high, you can keep the battletech C-Bill Costs, but just scale it in accordance. So, say a base number of 500k per-kill, plus an additional 25% of the cost of the unit you killed, so say, by killing 4 BattleArmor, you could afford a BattleArmor of your own based on just the percentage, let alone the 500k extra.

This will make it so mechs, vehicles, or even battlearmor won't be bought in the first 2 seconds of Battle. By the time people can afford them from enough kills it will seem like they are calling in for re-inforcements as the battle escalates, but it also means that everyone has a good chance of being able to afford any unit within the timespan of the match. It's also a rewards good players while still giving not-so-good players a chance to catch up. Good players, who know what they're doing, can take out a Mech and get the 500k base XP + 25% of the cost of the mech.

For example, the Gladiator is almost 40mil C-Bills which means you get 10mil bonus on top of your 500k base kill cash, so you can afford a light mech by taking out that heavy, so on and so forth.

Just throwing that out there...

[Zooch]

That could work...or even having the whole "bounty" idea where the more people you kill (in a row) the higher money you give to the person that kills you.

A lot of these ideas are only good in one instance so we have to be careful, but yes, there are many ways to go about this.

[Criminal]

Great find! This is a VERY exhaustive list of everything and honestly we've been asking around and looking around for something like this.

I think one of the best things we could do would be to (like defender did) come up with a forumla not only for scoring but for scaling the cost down the costs and values to more manageable numbers.

This will become an important document and after Kami and I have a chance to bounce some ideas off eachother we may be looking for suggestions.

[Iron Hands]

Yeah, it's pretty damn snazzy.
Looking at those numbers, I had an Idea for balancing unit costs.

I'm not sure how you're doing costs per unit, balancing unit cost for unit type, salvage, and kill rewards.
I had an Idea though.

Say, since the numbers are so high, you can keep the battletech C-Bill Costs, but just scale it in accordance. So, say a base number of 500k per-kill, plus an additional 25% of the cost of the unit you killed, so say, by killing 4 BattleArmor, you could afford a BattleArmor of your own based on just the percentage, let alone the 500k extra.

This will make it so mechs, vehicles, or even battlearmor won't be bought in the first 2 seconds of Battle. By the time people can afford them from enough kills it will seem like they are calling in for re-inforcements as the battle escalates, but it also means that everyone has a good chance of being able to afford any unit within the timespan of the match. It's also a rewards good players while still giving not-so-good players a chance to catch up. Good players, who know what they're doing, can take out a Mech and get the 500k base XP + 25% of the cost of the mech.

For example, the Gladiator is almost 40mil C-Bills which means you get 10mil bonus on top of your 500k base kill cash, so you can afford a light mech by taking out that heavy, so on and so forth.

Just throwing that out there...

IDK, I still think that this whole idea of players catching up in money with each other just so they can buy bigger mechs all a sudden makes the game sound to arcadish. It’s an old and worn out play stile. People hate games like QW or BF2, they just don’t know it yet. The second you add money to the equation, it will turn into a game of who has the most. That’s not fun and thats not what MW should be about.

When an enemy attacks, both sides dont just kill each other for money and then go buy robots. Cant we come up with anything more origianal than that? Because I know I could(have) and when you think about it, the curent systems used today just seem so damn stupid. And I'm sorry, but theres no amount of destructible terrain or pretty graphics that’s going to change that.

[madact]

I'm with IronHands here... though money might be made to work in other ways, like having a starting budget which has to last you the round/match. This would introduce some interesting strategic decisions, like a choice of striking hard and early, or wearing the enemy down. I think this would be more involving than the normal 'kill stuff to get bigger guns' approach.

Scenarios such as:
 Having a small force pinned down, holding out for reinforcements (which get introduced halfway thru a round, say)
 Wave assaults on a stronghold
 Deploying a beachhead from a dropship into hostile territory
which are deeper than the average online fps, could be seriously hampered by a cash-for-kills system.

[anchovy]

I'm with IronHands here... though money might be made to work in other ways, like having a starting budget which has to last you the round/match.

This is a very good idea.


Anch

[Defender]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=at9hxU864Fg

"Look at the bright side Kid, you get to keep all the money."

Now, i don't want the game to turn into a money grub fest, but I also don't like the thought of only having set money in my pocket either. I buy something, it gets destroyed randomly, by somebody, instantly. I'm out of money and can't buy another...that would peeve me. quite a bit. If I can just go out and risk my life to take out that heavy mech, and make enough to get back to where I was, that's cool.

Battletech, and Mechwarrior, had alot to do with money. It's not like it's just getting thrown in there as a filler for no apparent reason like Counter Strike. Also, with money in the game, the server settings can be adjusted to account for how much money each player is given and for what. So, technically, you could join a server which limits your money, or join a server which gives you alot. Changes the game modes and game play just based on that alon. You wouldn't just get money for killing people, but also for capturing objectives I'd assume as well.

I know this isn't supposed to be another Mech Simulation, but in other Mech games, it was cool to kill people and salvage them, make some money, upgrade your own mechs, and go out and make a stronger unit. Unless you just want the free, grab a unit sitting in the bay, fight the noob next to you for the vehicle mentality, I don't really think money is all that evil.

Although, I do agree that we should all start out with a nice pocket of change to do what we want, but I don't think you should go around unrewarded for kills and captures when money is already such a major part of Battletech.

[lkavadas]

Two things:

1.  OMG, that video is awesome.  It's been forever since I've seen it.  Y'all have to include the Commando in this mod.  I'm pretty sure I speak for everyone who has played through the Mechwarriors when I say that first few missions in Mw2: Mercs were awesome as you struggled through them with the Commando.  What a fantastic mech.  Maybe ditch the Flea for it?  I don't think the Flea is popular anyways.

2.  Why not allow servers to track a player's income as they play?  Like you quit the server with X c-bills but when you login next time those c-bills will be there waiting for you.  Optional of course.

[thezeus18]

I don't like the idea of you going from infantry to Atlas in a single match. I think that the accumulation of money should be more like that of skill points in Battlefield 2, instead of like money in CS. As you do more and more for your military by winning rounds and stuff, it rewards you with promotions to higher ranks, and these higher ranks give you more money per round. Money should be something you save throughout your time playing the mod, not something that's reset whenever you switch servers. While this does mean that better players get big vehicles, making them even harder to defeat, it also means they're bigger, higher profile targets.

My two cents.

[FDISK]

I don't like the idea of you going from infantry to Atlas in a single match. I think that the accumulation of money should be more like that of skill points in Battlefield 2, instead of like money in CS. As you do more and more for your military by winning rounds and stuff, it rewards you with promotions to higher ranks, and these higher ranks give you more money per round. Money should be something you save throughout your time playing the mod, not something that's reset whenever you switch servers. While this does mean that better players get big vehicles, making them even harder to defeat, it also means they're bigger, higher profile targets.

My two cents.

this is a good ideal but you would need a central server to keep up with everyones money or stats, but then you run the risk of stat padding by certain players and clans, i seen this happen on bf2142 and ETQW. 1 clan with so many players will go on a empty server and one or two would be on the opposing team building turrents and such while their fellow clan mates are on the other team blasting away at the turrents upping thier stats or xp or rank. Maybe have a centralize bank where you can get a loan to equip yourself with enough equipment to start with and direct deposit your funds everytime you gain any with a small percentage or let the player set the amount toward paying the loan off so that way when the loan is payed off the player can get another loan but at a higher value to equip him or her up the next refit, also able to keep money back for repairs and such.

[thezeus18]

I don't like the idea of you going from infantry to Atlas in a single match. I think that the accumulation of money should be more like that of skill points in Battlefield 2, instead of like money in CS. As you do more and more for your military by winning rounds and stuff, it rewards you with promotions to higher ranks, and these higher ranks give you more money per round. Money should be something you save throughout your time playing the mod, not something that's reset whenever you switch servers. While this does mean that better players get big vehicles, making them even harder to defeat, it also means they're bigger, higher profile targets.

My two cents.

this is a good ideal but you would need a central server to keep up with everyones money or stats, but then you run the risk of stat padding by certain players and clans, i seen this happen on bf2142 and ETQW. 1 clan with so many players will go on a empty server and one or two would be on the opposing team building turrents and such while their fellow clan mates are on the other team blasting away at the turrents upping thier stats or xp or rank. Maybe have a centralize bank where you can get a loan to equip yourself with enough equipment to start with and direct deposit your funds everytime you gain any with a small percentage or let the player set the amount toward paying the loan off so that way when the loan is payed off the player can get another loan but at a higher value to equip him or her up the next refit, also able to keep money back for repairs and such.

I think stat padders would just lose out, frankly, because you're not going to be good enough to actually use the Mechs if you cheat your way to them. Or at least, that's how it should be.

As for the stat tracking server, what about using your server?

[Defender]

I'm not sure how easy it would be to have a ranked server, where your stats on that particular server are tracked. It would be cool, to say, have a server you favorite where all your money and prestige is tracked so when you come back to the server all your money and rank is still available for the next match.

In that respect, it wouldn't seem like every match on that server is a grind to get the mech, you can continue where you left off and bring your mechs, aircraft, tanks, vehicles and equipment into the fray from the start.

This train of thought also bring other server possibilities into play for clan and league matches where your stats are tracked, but there are still pre-requisite settings on the server that define how much money each player starts with, what equipment is available, how long each match plays out and all sorts of other fancy variables to define and make every match different.

[FDISK]

well i dont think what i am trying to get across is a rank server. What i am thinking is something that is still mechwarrior theme. Like starting something like a comstar banking system. Where each player and or companie when they start collecting c-bills and equipment they can upload to a account they created with comstar all their c-bills and equip list so that way when they go to a separate server it can query the players account name with the comstar bank and see what that player has equipment and money wise and use it on that server. Lets say i have a merc companie that specializes in long range artillary support and some house or clan companie wants to hire me in a upcoming battle or match because they are strong in certain areas but weak in artillary and want to hire my companie to provide artillary support. So we meet discuss what they need plus terms then after we hash it out the house or clan companie that hires me deposits eather c-bills, equipment or a mixture of both to meet my companies terms into my comstar account. Or when the clan companies bids or the inner sphere companies bid, and or campaign or match winnings would be automatically deposited. And along with all that each player and companies experiance points. Lol i know this is alot to ask for but hey i can wish cant i