Tank and mech revetments around bases

[Arghy]

Revetments are basically bunkers, they'd be a hole dug in the ground with high sides allowing the tank/mech to roll into the bunker and only expose its turret/torso. These would be positioned around the bases and key choke points on the map so both sides could take ground and dig in. The tank revetments could even have roofs so they'd be extremely hard to destroy with missiles.

The mech revetments could simply be box obstructions with maybe a roof or just a deeply dug hole in a hill allowing mechs to expose very little of themselves while firing at any enemys in their arc.

BAs, air and artillery units would get a very important role as you advance because only they could dig the defenders out.

[-SM-SUCKER]

I am sorry, but I do not like this idea very much.
The game as it is can become quite campy, where both teams just sit on their side of the hill waiting for the other team to make the first move or some individuals rushing and quickly dying.
Giving them another reason to camp their bases (the defensive turrets are there ae well) would just motivate more people to stay stationary and shoot down vtols and aeros without actually entering the battlefield.

And besides, the mechs are of different heights, thus it would probalby not be possible to get a good solution. And as the weapon mounts are also at different positions, the opening would still be large, not providing that much cover.

[Virt]

Sucker pretty much summed up my views too.

[thedrunkennoob]

This would work in a different gamemode but not in current SA IMO.

[SquareSphere }12thVR{]

I'm not for anything any that encourages trench line warfare.

[(TLL)KitLightning]

This would be a good idea if the trenches weren't close enough to gain the protection from the Turret/LAMS. Having instalments like this around the map would make it more fun trying to advance and gain hold of certain sectors of the map.
It would thou be nice to see a real trench warfare with only tanks

[Arghy]

Yeah this would be for game modes like power nodes were you need to take and hold an installation to make another installation open and eventually make the enemy base vulnerable to assault. We already have defensive areas that are just natural outcroppings of rocks which only mechs can use while tanks struggle to get over the same terrain. When theres actually purpose built defensive dug outs tanks will not only be inclined to get up the hill they'll be rewarded. Tanks will also open up a whole new range of tactics with their ability to entrench and hold the line against much more expensive mechs.

In the current SA theres honestly no reason to assault or defend your base but if your base was a structure that could be destroyed and make you lose i'd personally want well made defenses defend it. Whats missing in the game atm is paved roads leading to rises--i tried to play as a LT and i couldent travel anywhere that allowed me to fire and see my shell fall. If there was purpose built rises that allowed ground vehicles to snipe from you'd open them fire from all angles but in exchange they would get a platform.

[~SJ~ Blhurr]

I'm not totally opposed to this.  I think if done with care it could add to some game modes.  I kind of like trench warfare as long as the maps provide some opportunity to flank the trenches.  There's nothing quite as fun as flanking a trench that thinks it is secure.  Besides if aero and LTs are doing their job trenches should be of mixed effectiveness. 

[Freakazoid]

I can't imagine revetments working properly. They'd either be too small for large and assault mechs to use effectively or too tall for light and medium mechs to fire over. Mechs and tanks just don't have enough dexterity to move in and out of cover to shoot and not get hit in return.

[Arghy]

The mech equivalent would basically be a large wall/building with holes in it allowing the defending mech to pull behind cover to avoid missiles and enemy fire. Firing from the revetment would in no way be like a FPS, you'd have a very limited field of fire and view and moving would be complicated affair. The entire point of entering one is its better to be standing in one rather then standing out in the open on a hill.

I've noticed in clear cut when i went out as a demolisher that i could smash mechs down this strait away but i got pounded by missiles and every ranged weapon that was on the field because i was basically sitting in the middle of the road. If i could have pulled into a hull down position on the hill instead and gone passive i would have been extremely hard to spot and even if they spotted me hard to hit.

Imagine if there was a cluster of concrete mech bunkers all over the maps allowing brawlers to run from cover to cover crossing the field while counter ranged mechs got lock ons through their firing slits and launched salvo after salvo of LRM's over the barriers.

[Jaso the Sniper]

I suggest someone make a custom map and invite lots of people to play and test this idea.

[benben10]

+1 to jason's idea.

[cocoajin]

This would be benefical once there are objectives to take and hold...TDM wouldnt really suit it, but trench warfare is a given once you've obtained something you'd rather the enemy not gain/re-gain.

But I also think that the bunkers not be invincible, that they have HP values that cause them to fail during the match.  So they may protect you, but its sacrificial and finite...eventually it fails.

Does the enginew have various states for objects/structures?

[Arghy]

I dont think it does but you could just make the roofs of the bunkers be destroyed so once its taken enough fire it would be little more then skeletal walls. The bunkers would still be vulnerable to splash weapons so LT's and fire bombs would be key to advancing through a well dug in enemy as well as proper BA support. UT2004 had a very good game type that would be suit the bunkers perfect. I forget what it was called but basically each team had a point counter/generator and the only way to attack their points was to capture a chain of little bases until you held enough to connect to their main base.

I cant imagine combat being the same as it is now when its no longer DM--you'll want to rush forward then hold which is basically impossible now. Adding defensive structures and hull down revetments for tanks would allow an armored thrust to defeat the defenders then hold the point against the counter attack.

[Jaso the Sniper]

For bunkers destroying use non-physical objects (where was that thread?) and are you thinking walls or trenches?

edit: for trenches, you could also add connections for tanks to not expose themselves

they could be tunnels or trenches