MechWarrior: Living Legends

Beta Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: ^sPikE- on January 17, 2011, 01:27:59 AM

Title: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ^sPikE- on January 17, 2011, 01:27:59 AM
Davids vs. Goliaths:
The Essential guide to Elemental/BA in MWLL 0.4.x

*beginner note*: BA (Battle Armor) or Elemental is the "infantry" of MWLL. It is what you first start with when entering a game. You can then choose and buy a vehicle, but you can also choose to play the role of Dedicated Battle Armor, which means you will buy certain gear you cannot when you choose to go with vehicles (except for the APC).


While Mechwarrior Living Legends is a game based mainly on vehicle combat, many players might overlook the advantages playing as plain infantry brings. I have been using lots of BA since 0.1.0 and it has come to be my favourite way to play the game. In this guide i will break down why playing as BA can many a time be just as effective as manning a vehicle, can bring great advantage to your team, and how to properly play the role of BA to succeed in MWLL.


1. THE GEAR

So, you decided to go BA. Now enter the buy menu. The only buy options we will be looking at for dedicated BA are under the WEAPONS tab, and the APC under the VEHICLES tab. As you can see, there are the following items available to you:

-Bear AutoCannon (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BearAC (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BearAC))
-AC2 (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_AC2 (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_AC2))
-Manpack PPC (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_PPC (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_PPC))
-Small Beam Laser (default weapon) (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_SBL (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_SBL))
-Heavy Beam Laser (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_MHL (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_MHL))
-TAG Laser (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_TAG (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_TAG))
-C8 grenades (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=C8 (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=C8)
-Flamer (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_Flamer (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=BA_Flamer))
-Inferno grenades (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=Inferno_Charge (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=Inferno_Charge))
-NARC grenades (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=NARC (http://wiki.mechlivinglegends.net/index.php?title=NARC))

Additionally, every BA has 2 mounted SRM launchers that cannot be dropped/exchanged for other weapons.

Now, im sure many people have their own preffered configurations, but there is only one that is truly optimal in terms of damage output and flexibility. MpPPC, Heavy Laser, and as many C8 grenades as you can afford. If you dont have enough cbills for this setup, i would rather reccommend that you ask teammates for money to buy it, then buying another one. Why this is so:

The PPC is the most versatile of BA weapons. It has a rather high damage output, does splash damage, triggers an EMP that fries enemy electronics for a brief time (great in night combat, enemy loses infrared vision), shakes the enemy's view when hit, increases the enemy's heat when hit, and finally it boosts you in the opposite direction of firing. The latter prevents you from campsniping, but can be extremely useful when avoiding enemy shots, and when travelling long distances.

The Heavy Laser is the strongest of the BA weapons. When used right it will provide you with many kills and much score. It is a danger to anything that is within 175m of you. Its pinpoint accuracy and high damage output make it a must for any dedicated BA.

The C8 grenades are best simply because they do most damage. NARC and Inferno are also good for certain situations, but due to the buggy nature of grenades i believe its best to go for highest damage output.

We will cover specific tactics with these weapons later on.

You can buy your setup in the base, but it is usually better to wait and deploy the APC first, as you can gain additional cbills from teammates buying/spawning at your APC as you travel to the field. You can then purchase any additional gear, like grenades, when you deploy your APC.

2. THE APC

The Armored Personell Carrier, or APC, is the BA's best friend. It is currently the only vehicle in the game that permits you to enter with your full dedicated BA gear, so it will be your transport of choice when starting off. The main advantages of the APC are:

-it allows you to spawn as BA on its location, wherever it is on the map
-it allows you, and all your teammates, including those in vehicles, to buy gear and ammo near its location.
-it provides you with score whenever a teammate spawns at it or buys  gear/ammo at it
-it allows the transport of additional BA, aside from the driver (6 iirc)

When driving the APC to the front, much like in real estate, one thing must be kept in mind. Location, location, location. Where you place your APC will be vital to its effectivness. It needs to be close enough to the battlefield so you dont travel for too long, but far or hidden enough not to be spotted and destroyed by the enemy. It is also useful if the APC is parked at a relativley accessible spot so your teammates dont spend too long reloading, but this also makes it more accessible to the enemy. 

Many maps have rocks that make great camo for the APC, try ramming straight at them and park it at a unusual angle, as this will make it harder to spot. You can also park it at a high location like a mountain or even a pyramid, thus enabling friendly aeros to refill closer to the field. If the map you are playing on has one of those bases with a wall surrounding them, parking the APC right behind the wall will allow teammates to buy from beyond the wall, thus keeping the APC hidden (you must however inform them it is there).

Wherever you park it, make sure you tell your teammates that it is deployed.

3. MANEUVERING AND TACTICS

So now youve deployed your APC, bought your gear, and are ready to fight. So lets look at some advantages you have as BA over enemy vehicles:

-The ability to very quickly take cover. Remember, along with your small profile, this is your greatest advantage. Always try to make sure you have some cover nearby, and it will save your life many times. Use crouching when necessary, and make sure your not hiding in such a place where splash damage from rockets or PPC hitting a nearby wall might damage you.

-Aiming. Unlike vehicle drivers whose view turning rates are slowed down depending on the type of vehicle, you have the perfect action FPS view and aim. Use this to your advantage and try to always move and shoot at the same time.

-Distraction. It works both ways. When you are near an enemy and there are friendlies on the way, engage the target and keep evading it so you make a distraction while your allies get into position and open fire. Your target will usually engage them back, allowing you freely engage its back torso armor. But also, when you see an enemy dueling with an ally, feel free to engage. As long as the ally lives you will not concern your enemy much, but be prepared to quickly zip into cover if your ally is destroyed.

Some general tips:

It is essential that you learn to use your jumpjets properly. Only use your whole charge when you need to snipe something from high up, otherwise use short bursts and try to never be completely without. Combine sprint and short bursts for travelling horizontally.

When attacking as BA, you have to pay attention to your weapon reload times. SRMs take longest to reload, so the correct firing order for maximum damage is: PPC, HL, PPC, SRM, HL, and repeat. Dont wait for weapon to reload, learn to switch weapons in this order and you will maximize your damage output.

BA are most effective in a team. If there is another BA near you make sure you two stick together (while keeping a little distance so they dont doublekill you), as you provide cover fire and a distraction for each other.

Radar. Remember to allways select your target on the radar and read his armor status (defaults: E-nearest enemy; T-next enemy). Use your accuracy and maneuverability advantage to attack the part of the enemy that is the most damaged. When multiple targets are in range, cycle through them and check if any of them are badly damaged. Sometimes mech pilots eject from their mech, destroying their cockpit armor. If you see such a target move in at once, and spam Everything youve got on the cockpit. A single well placed PPC should kill the pilot and leave you with a mech to comandeer/destroy.

Grenades. They are very buggy at the moment. 90% you will not be able to make them stick to an enemy, but there are specific cases when you can, and it those cases C8 gives you such a damage boost you need to take that opportunity. Whenever the enemy vehicle is still, moving in the same direction with the same speed as you, or charging directly towards you, the grenades will usually stick. Also, if you manage to land on an enemy vehicle, all the grenades will stick, but careful to gtfo before they go off.

Your PPC. Use it wisely and it will save your life many a time.when you see an enemy aiming at you, splash it in the face with the PPC and its view will rock so hard it will give you the extra 2-3 seconds to get to cover. When you need to get somewhere quickly and have nothing specific to shoot at, fire the PPC in the opposite direction and enjoy a slight but important speed boost (also good when evading without jumpjets). The PPC is also the weapon with the longest range you have. If there is heavily damaged enemy running away from you, jumpjet up and keep shooting him, in many cases you will land a kill. When engaging other BA with it wait for the Enemy to come to a still point (peak of the jump or the moment when he hits the ground). This will make him a lot easier to hit.



Im hoping this will help some of the newer players and those who claim they suck at BA :)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: DFDelta on January 17, 2011, 02:24:03 AM
Gameplay tipps:

Keep moving. A BA standing in the open is a dead BA, even if you are behind the only enemy in sight and he is facing into the other direction. You don't have to jump around like a maniac, but even small movements in a 10m diameter will keep enemies outside your radar range from oneshotting you with Gauss, Lasers and even PPCs if you are lucky.

Infernos vs BA. Infernos are one of the best BA vs BA weapons. If you see a enemy BA exhausting all his JJ, throw a Inferno where you think he will land. If your calculations are good he will have no time to get out of the huge blast radius before getting blown up. It takes practice, but it is worth it.

Lern what enemy units generally have C3 and stay away from them. Any unit that carries a C3 is a BAs worst nightmare. Getting into radar range of one of those (and since they often have BHP, their range is huge) is like shouting "hey here I am, snipe me with large lasers please". Lerning from this, we know that you should generally stay away from Owens and Ravens.

You are one of the best scouts out there, use cover, sneakieness and the team chat to report enemy positions and units to your friends, and once they engage join the battle.

For the same reason you are the perfect guy taking care of that LT harrassing your team. A well played BA can get behind the enemy lines, behind the LT and destroy it with a quick MPPC/mHL/C8 combo to the rear before anyone can react.

Lern to snipe with your AC2. Especially on maps like Kagoshima, where you find plenty of steep hills that protect you from most enemy return fire, a BA standing outside of radar range and plinking on enemy armor with an AC2 can bind and distract a lot of people, and everyone who is searching you is one less enemy for your team to fight.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Saber15 on January 17, 2011, 02:24:37 AM
-If you're piloting a vehicle, a Flamer or AC/2 is the weapon you should buy. The PPC and HML are stripped when entering a vehicle.

-Battlearmor combat is basically an extremely slow version of Starsiege: Tribes or Tribes 2 combat. If you learn to play either of those (they're free fyi), you'll wipe the floor with 90% of the other BA players.

- The Bear Autocannon is useless, never take it. It's not a terrible gun but the AC/2 and HML work so much better 90% of the time.

-Inferno grenades are amazingly effective at killing BA, as they have a huge splash radius that instantly kills BA. However, the explosion distance is bigger than the throwing distance, so jump as soon as you throw it  ::)

-Always try to jump on the enemy mech's head. They won't be able to shoot you (unless both of you have lag spikes) and you can kill them at your leisure. Aim for the guns, then the torso if you're feeling evil. Pumas are basically BA landing pads on legs.

-NEVER EVER NEVER get near a tank's front or rear end. They'll just plow you down. Seriously I keep mowing down BA because they think hiding infront of me is a good idea.

-NEVER EVER NEVER jump up to shoot at aerospace or VTOLs coming towards you. They'll just plow you down in midair, or blast you to bits with their anti-air weaponry.

-Flamers are powerful on certain maps, like Extremity and Inferno. Keeping a Flamer and a HML allows you to heat up enemy mechs to shut down, then cut off their weapons.

-Battlearmor can fit in hard to reach spots on mechs. For example, if you land on an enemy vulture, crouch down next to the cockpit on top of the missile pods. His teammates will only be able to shoot you from the side or front, and they'll risk hitting their buddy.

-C8 thrown onto a mech's hip (NOT THE LEG) will severely damage the leg. If you toss a C8 onto an Owen's lower side torso, it will explosively leg them when it goes off.

-Do NOT attempt to engage a Harasser when you have no teammates. They'll just blast you to bits, and/or run you over. Their extremely unpredictable (the only predictable thing about the Harasser is that there is a 302958% chance of it flipping) handling means that they can whip around in a second, drive backwards straight up a mountain, then do a backflip and crush you.

-Do NOT attempt to engage anti-air units when you have no teammates.

-Two battlearmor players working together are very hard to kill.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ^sPikE- on January 17, 2011, 02:33:33 AM
-NEVER EVER NEVER jump up to shoot at aerospace or VTOLs coming towards you. They'll just plow you down in midair, or blast you to bits with their anti-air weaponry.

I strongly disagree. I killed dozens of low flying aeros and vtols by jumping up to a height where my heavy laser can fry them. Especially aeors tend to avoid fire by flying low, those make great target when they fly by you.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: dsi1 on January 17, 2011, 02:36:00 AM
The AC2 is the the most flexible Anti-BA weapon, pack it if you're a pilot and pack it if you're facing large amounts of enemy BA. Infernos are always a good idea to have as well.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Saber15 on January 17, 2011, 02:37:56 AM
I strongly disagree. I killed dozens of low flying aeros and vtols by jumping up to a height where my heavy laser can fry them. Especially aeors tend to avoid fire by flying low, those make great target when they fly by you.
Whenever I see a battlearmor player jumping up to take potshots at my plane, I just zip in at the apex of his jump, run him over and turn him into a fine paste on my aero's fuselage. I've killed a dozen BAs doing this.
Shooting 'em is fine if they aren't paying attention or ignoring you. Once they notice you, then you duck down.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Cloudburst on January 17, 2011, 02:42:50 AM

If you manage to land on an enemy vehicle that doesn't have MASC and have an AC2, that vehicle is fapping toast if someone doesn't snipe you off of it real quick. Don't throw C8's in any situation in which you can safely stay on an enemy mech for more than 10 seconds.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: DFDelta on January 17, 2011, 02:44:00 AM
The AC2 is the the most flexible Anti-BA weapon, pack it if you're a pilot and pack it if you're facing large amounts of enemy BA. Infernos are always a good idea to have as well.

The AC2 is also a good AA weapon. It can deal about 70% of a RAC5 (!!!) to any plane that is foolish enough to pass you at under 150m. Especially Shivas are hard to miss, a Sulla takes a little more then a single full reload if it is undamaged (tough this is unrealistic to archive in live combat, due to the spread). I have used this to severely damage ASF that passed me.
2 BA that have learned the rythm to shot the AC2 with 100% accuracy each shot can make a plane retreat.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Askis on January 17, 2011, 02:56:21 AM
Never underestimate the basic Small Beam Laser.
It doesn't do much damage compared to the HML or the PPC, but it has a quick refire rate, a decent range (~300m) and is pinpoint accurate.
If you can keep it on target it is more than enough to kill enemy BA and is also quite useful against vehicles.

The PPC is also the weapon with the longest range you have.

Untrue.
The AC2 has more than double the range (~500m for the PPC, ~1200m for the AC2), although you'll have to fire single shots with a slight pause between each one to be accurate and therefore won't do much damage.

Also, two hits from an AC2 will kill a BA, which makes it a nice sniper weapon if you've spotted an enemy BA who isn't moving too much.

- The Bear Autocannon is useless, never take it. It's not a terrible gun but the AC/2 and HML work so much better 90% of the time.

The BearAC is a small MG and only effective at 55m or less, it doesn't do much damage even to BA and none at all to any vehicles with heavy armor (Mechs, Tanks). A pilot is better off with an AC2, Flamer or the basic SBL and a dedicated BA with the HML or PPC.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: SquareSphere on January 17, 2011, 03:43:30 AM
Good guide, put it up in the Wiki :D

I agree, out in the open the mPPC/HML +C8 is the best load out, BUT with the introduction of TC I actually pack the class mPPC/AC2 +C8 loadout when defending points.  AC2 allows you to keep pumping damage while not giving away position away with the huge yellow beam, at the same time it actually deals more burst damage and if you have to dodge back into cover quickly, where as the HML leaves you exposed if you want to deal full damage.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: AlfalphaCat on January 17, 2011, 04:06:41 AM
OOOOOhhh, looky wut I found, A Treasure trove of wisdom!!! :) :) [(no sarcasm font, because i give you all +1(karmafairystrikesfirst!!!!XD)]

(http://todaysfacilitymanager.com/facilityblog/wp-content/uploads/video-games.jpeg)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Mekabuser=12thVR= on January 17, 2011, 05:07:43 AM
OOOOOhhh, looky wut I found, A Treasure trove of wisdom!!! :) :) [(no sarcasm font, because i give you all +1(karmafairystrikesfirst!!!!XD)]

(http://todaysfacilitymanager.com/facilityblog/wp-content/uploads/video-games.jpeg)
same
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Dragonzord on January 17, 2011, 09:13:28 PM
with the PPC trick of using it to move...

I generally use it when fighting enemy mechs. like if i come in above them, or if i see them aiming at me, i fire it directly upwards and they always miss, then you can sprint/jump jet to their legs before they can aim and generally thats giving you a huge advantage.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Brainwright on January 17, 2011, 09:24:20 PM
The only safe place when dealing with a mech is about 30 to 50 degrees above its field of view.  Most people aren't accurate enough due to lag when you drop back down after a good jet, but many people are, and if they have splash weapons, lag doesn't matter.

When jetting toward a moving mech, pull out ahead of it rather than try approaching directly or from behind.  They're a lot faster than you, and a few seconds under power can open a lot of space after you've expended jump juice.  That's a mighty fine firing range.

Don't make any move toward a mech or any other asset that doesn't plant you in cover or directly at its feet/head/tracks.

Oh, and that guy who mentioned battle armor as superior scouts?  He's on crack.  Nine times out of ten, you'll be detected and hounded as a mark of pride on the K/D ratio.  The only valid methods of combat as battle armor are long range or with distraction from your teammates.  You're just a squishy little berry amidst a world of ravenous, berry-eating hordes.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Warhammer WHM-6R on January 17, 2011, 09:54:38 PM
Great tips. Now some cool screenshots with some nice big green arrows to clarify (not really necessary but always looks professional) and you have a first rate tutorial for the wiki.
Karma for all BA pros. I hope to see you all at the pointy end of my 85 ton clan assault tank  ;D

Seriously awesome initiative Spike
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CHH Siege on January 18, 2011, 01:03:44 AM
<hubris>
Pro Tip:

-When in BA, avoid (CHHs/MWLL)Siege at all costs, at all times (unless I am also in BA, which is fair game). If  there aren't at least 4 of you and I am also alone, you WILL die. ESPECIALLY if I have a Partisan or Huit Prime, or a Mk II Echo, nothing can save you but terrain and retreat, and terrain will only help for just so long.

(I cut my teeth in the alpha killing a laggy-ass KitLighting in BA trying to camp my spawn. If I can kill Kit at range, I can kill any BA, with pretty much any weapon.)
</hubris>

But seriously, I and other players pick load-outs based on the fact we're liable to encounter BA. Make sure you keep to cover, work with friendly mechs or vehicles, learn to recognize the BA-killer variants, and in general recognize that BA has its own unique role. BA demands a unique play style in many ways, especially within the scope of our own game, and knowing how to pick your battles and evade the wrong enemy will be very key to your success (or failure).
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: AlfalphaCat on January 18, 2011, 04:21:22 AM
Tip:  Never assume any vehicles weapon loadout is not effective against you, as a BA.  ATMs are the only thing that won't kill BA, and I'm not even sure if that's the case. :D
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Because people mistake me for someone else on January 18, 2011, 04:36:47 PM
Also try to avoid or bypass any assets with BHP/BAP....they will mark you out like nothing and then those pesky PPCs and ACs will be brought to bear against you ;===)

Partisan Prime XP FTW xD
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Askis on January 18, 2011, 05:39:39 PM
ATMs are the only thing that won't kill BA, and I'm not even sure if that's the case. :D

Oh they will, but only at >150m ;)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: zombat on January 18, 2011, 08:20:34 PM
How to mpPPC-scoot like a pro:
1. Learn your terrain, this is very important for the next step. At the very least try to remember the gradients of the next 200m in front of you
2. Turn 180 degress to the direction you wish to go
3. Starting sprinting backwards with shift-s
4. Whilst still sprinting short-tap your jumpjets just enough to keep you between 5-10ft from the ground. This is where knowledge of the terrain comes in handy.
5. At the apex of your last boost fire your PPC with a slight (about 10 degrees) minus angle.

Simples!



Also don't use the Bear Auto Cannon, despite having a fierce name it is by far the most useless peice of crap a BA can carry


And when stood on top of a mech keep looking around between shots to make sure your ride isn't driving you to an unfriendly turret or a buddy of his.
If he is drop a C8 nade into the damaged section and bail out
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: (TLL)Siilk on January 19, 2011, 06:16:35 AM
 A lot of excellent BA tips in this thread, +karma for every BA pro!
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Stahlseele on January 19, 2011, 06:11:00 PM
Also: Get to know your Weapons.
The mPPC has an INCREDIBLE reach!
You can more or less safely snipe at 500 to 650m, if you can see that far.
I just wish the BA's moved a bit faster on the ground or got a bigger sprinting modifier . .
It takes waayy too loong to get to the interesting places in most maps from the hangar <.<
Yes, i know that that's what APC's are there for. But don't tell me you don't make it a point to kill every last single one of them, as soon as you find them.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ^sPikE- on January 19, 2011, 08:03:44 PM
Also: Get to know your Weapons.
The mPPC has an INCREDIBLE reach!
You can more or less safely snipe at 500 to 650m, if you can see that far.
I just wish the BA's moved a bit faster on the ground or got a bigger sprinting modifier . .
It takes waayy too loong to get to the interesting places in most maps from the hangar <.<
Yes, i know that that's what APC's are there for. But don't tell me you don't make it a point to kill every last single one of them, as soon as you find them.

hence the need for epic APC placement :) most of mine get deployed in under 5 mins and stay ingame until the end.

i really like how this thread turned out, great work guys.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Stahlseele on January 19, 2011, 08:53:24 PM
Mine allways get found, even if i do go around on the outside with radar off and place it outside of the main advancement routes <.<
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Squibby on January 19, 2011, 09:36:00 PM
They're like BA nests, you must exterminate them with fire :D,
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Stahlseele on January 19, 2011, 09:45:10 PM
Which is exactly what happens.
Mech with flamethrowers keeps flaming it untill it is gone, and any ba spawning there in the mean time is immediately immolated and dead again of course <.<
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: GB-72AT Talon on January 20, 2011, 06:46:30 AM
Attempting to hitch a ride on top of a tank or mech even can kill you quickly. 

No you cannot stand on my Partisan AC5 turret and stay alive.....you will die.

Grenades are broken for the most part, I don't use them at all, ever.  Waste of time.

The only loadout I use is mPPC + MicroHeavyLaser, its brutal. 

On dark maps or in the dark remember that your mPPC and face shield glows in the dark like a lighter at a Bon Jovi concert.....just because its dark doesn't mean they can't see you.  Actually I am known for sniping BA at 650meters on Thunder Rift using the mPPC.  I see them in the dark by their visor/weapon glow.

You cannot shut down battle armor, so once you are in close range of enemy mechs they know where you are.

Battle Armor armor heals over time, if your indicator is red, find cover and wait until it turns green again. 


Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Taemien on January 20, 2011, 06:48:30 AM
Tip:  Never assume any vehicles weapon loadout is not effective against you, as a BA.  ATMs are the only thing that won't kill BA, and I'm not even sure if that's the case. :D

ATMs work, from a Sulla even  8)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Blu_Haze on January 20, 2011, 07:46:31 AM
If you're playing as a BA on any Terrain Control map, learn which bases have automated defenses, and stay far far away from them. The laser turrets will snipe you dead in 1-2 hits from 3 zones away.

When you eventually run into a demolisher, make a little "cha-ching" sound and then quickly hop up on top of his turret when he stops. Unlike the partisan, you won't die when he starts moving, and he'll be completely helpless against you. Crouch down up there and start shearing away his side armor with the HML until it pops. Most demo pilots won't have any idea what's going on, or that they're even taking major damage until it's too late, but keep an eye out in case he wises up and decides to bail.

Learn to use your jump jets while still up in the air. Most people instinctively think that their JJs only allow them to travel vertically, but they're actually multi-directional. When you're fighting against someone who knows you're there and is actively trying to kill you, holding down a movement key and using your jets will send you suddenly in that direction. For example, if you hold down A and tap the spacebar, it'll make you jet to the left. Holding D will do the same thing to the right. This allows you to remain unpredictable and helps you to dodge enemy fire.

As others have said, the mPPC has a knockback effect when you fire it. You can use this to your advantage though, with two different ways. One is to fire it in the direction opposite of where you want to move, in order to help you dodge enemy fire, similar to using your jumpjets mentioned above. Another is to help keep you aloft for longer, without as much of a predictable apex at the height of your jump. For example, when fighting an enemy mech at close range, it's often useful to jump directly above him, look down, and fire your mPPC straight down. This will not only make your movements less predictable, but it will also keep you in the air above him for longer, giving you an opportunity to switch to the Heavy Micro Laser for additional damage.

If you're having difficulty fighting other BA, give the mPPC a try. It will kill any enemy Battle Armor with one shot if it's a direct hit, and even if you don't hit them directly it still has considerable splash damage. The trick to using this effectively is to predict your enemies movements, and anticipate where you believe they will land on the ground. Most inexperienced BA will use up their entire jumpjet supply, leaving them very vulnerable for a few seconds after they land. This gives you the perfect opportunity to quickly kill them with your mPPC. When you get more experienced with using this weapon, you can have some fun with trying to pop enemy BA while they're still in mid-air with it.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: SquareSphere on January 20, 2011, 04:51:26 PM
Did we mention that if you crouch as a BA  your regeneration increases?  DO IT!!!!!

Grenades do work but are very situational.

- C8 -
DO NOT try to throw them on moving targets, most of the time they won't stick. 
DO throw them at stationary targets like missile boats, they will stick most of the time.  What I like to do is throw them on the back and start plinking away at the rear armor with my other weapons.  If the boat if not focused on you, should be able to do moderate damage to the back which is enough for a single C8 to punch through the rest of the back armor on lights (I've killed many a cougar this way)

- Inferno -
DO NOT try to use these on mechs or vehicles, they don't put out enough heat for a shut down and are easily combated with coolant
DO use them against other BA's great for clearing buildings or  when thrown in the predicted path of the BA on the ground.  Has a HUGE explosion radius that can very useful.

- NARC -
Again, DO NOT throw at moving targets
DO throw at stationary targets BUT remember to let your teammates know a NARC is up.
*Highly situational and not recommended in Pub games*

One more BA tip on TC.  The new sentries will NOT shoot at BA's unless you come within 250m.  What does this mean?  Position yourself outside of that range and use your mPPC to take out the turret.  It takes 2-3 mPPC shots to take them out.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Brainwright on January 20, 2011, 05:10:24 PM
One more BA tip on TC.  The new sentries will NOT shoot at BA's unless you come within 250m.  What does this mean?  Position yourself outside of that range and use your mPPC to take out the turret.  It takes 2-3 mPPC shots to take them out.

Addendum : most bases are positioned so that you'll only be able to see these turrets once you're in range.

Solution : start up a map on your own sometime and walk through it to find the best approach to a base you want to capture so you can destroy the turrets without getting yourself killed.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: DFDelta on January 20, 2011, 05:16:29 PM
One more BA tip on TC.  The new sentries will NOT shoot at BA's unless you come within 250m.  What does this mean?  Position yourself outside of that range and use your mPPC to take out the turret.  It takes 2-3 mPPC shots to take them out.

Addendum : most bases are positioned so that you'll only be able to see these turrets once you're in range.

Solution : start up a map on your own sometime and walk through it to find the best approach to a base you want to capture so you can destroy the turrets without getting yourself killed.

Better, find ways where you can get into tapping range without destroying the turrets.
They are a great help when you want to defend the base from the enemies counterstrike (or when getting rid of all those BAs that hide on almost every base)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Defender on January 20, 2011, 11:33:01 PM
USE YOUR MPPC LIKE YOU'RE PLAYING QUAKE 3 ARENA.
Rocket Jump your way to Success for added Boost and Distance!
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: AlfalphaCat on January 21, 2011, 02:39:25 AM
Have FUN!! That is my best tip, for those wishing to play as dedicated BA. 

Cause, ya know what, you won't always be effective all the time. 50/50 chance that you will do any significant damage, before being blasted 'out of the blue'. :)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: [CW]Strykerius on January 21, 2011, 05:18:30 PM
My advice; do not expect to win.  Your job is to be annoying, distracting, and a scout.  Unless you are either very experienced (And obviously not in need of this thread), or the other team is running nothing but missile boats and does not know how to shoot, you will not get many kills.  Elementals  are effective at what they do.  And unfortunately, that is not dedicated anti-mech combat.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ^sPikE- on January 21, 2011, 06:45:44 PM
My advice; do not expect to win.  Your job is to be annoying, distracting, and a scout.  Unless you are either very experienced (And obviously not in need of this thread), or the other team is running nothing but missile boats and does not know how to shoot, you will not get many kills.  Elementals  are effective at what they do.  And unfortunately, that is not dedicated anti-mech combat.

Its difficult to get any kills by yourself, but in a well coordinated team BA can crush ANYTHING. Esp. Assaults are so slow they are prime targets when me and my homies play. Only assets that have some type of small AC will pose a big problem, and even those can get pwned quickly by using cover and distraction.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: (TLL)KitLightning on January 22, 2011, 12:35:19 AM
Stay at your maximum range to limit the opponents visuals on you.

Make sure you have an escape path or at least some minor cover to hide by.

Create your BA loadout via the Buymenu Loadout screen, it already have the stock Crysis loadouts which you can alter as wanted. Set up different loadouts per mission objective, e.g. for BA Hunting or assaults on any armored Asset.

Share your C-Bills with the rest of the team. As a BA you only use roughly half of the C-Bills to purchase a full BA loadout form the C-Bills you get on the first rank. Players tend to become so happy when you donate your C-Bills to them ;D

Mostly the BA should act as a support asset that can add an annoyance to your enemies whilst your bigger bipedal fellows are exchanging metal with the hostile targets.

BTW when fighting as a BA, its rather easy to get a piece of the kill ratio imo, but it is by far the most risky of all assets to venture out in. I've been hunting Lights to Assault as a BA or a team of BA's and an Assault better deal with the BA quickly if there is more than two having their attention on the Assaults.
I've hunted down Lights to the gates of their Hangar or worse as I recall once hunting one back home just to wait outside and pick up the target after he had repaired, just to see him go puff after some more minutes of torture.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Stahlseele on January 22, 2011, 01:19:28 AM
can't remember the number of headshots i did in a BA . .
Using normal laser, heavy laser, PPC and SRM too . .
Nothing like seeing that 90k Mech suddenly stop, drop and roll after having hit it in the cockpit.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Greeny on January 24, 2011, 01:24:52 PM
Greets all

I have a few questions for the BA professionals

I've been playing MWLL for around 9 days and around 5 days ago I started playing a BA. 3 Days ago I read this guide and it helped a great deal.

My questions are:

Is there a trick to get bomb packs sticking to mechs when I throw them. They seem to bounce off often. Is it due to mech movement?

When I crouch down, does my scanner profile reduce? I notice some BAs are invisible on the scanner. How do they do that, did they stop moving? Crouch?

Is there a trick to faster loadouts? I often spawn at bases being overrun, but I'm often spawn killed before I have my preconfigured loadout selected.

There are maps with tickets; do BA's use less tickets to spawn then, oh.. an assault, or is it all 1 ticket?

Base turrets seem to give me zero chance, they never miss and are long range. (they can hit a BA but can't snipe a cockpit?) How long does it take them to respawn if I manage to remove one?

What is the running speed of a BA?
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: DFDelta on January 24, 2011, 02:33:51 PM
Is there a trick to get bomb packs sticking to mechs when I throw them. They seem to bounce off often. Is it due to mech movement?
Grenades are kinda buggy, they work best against standing targets, if a mech/tank is moving then they will bounce of most of the time.

When I crouch down, does my scanner profile reduce? I notice some BAs are invisible on the scanner. How do they do that, did they stop moving? Crouch?
No your radar signature stays the same when crouching.
BAs can become radar invisible if they are within of a friendly AECM. Also BAs have a very small radar signature to beginn with, a mech/tank without any electronics has to be within 100 or 150 (don't remember right now ;D) meters of the BA to see it.

Is there a trick to faster loadouts? I often spawn at bases being overrun, but I'm often spawn killed before I have my preconfigured loadout selected.


Don't think so, the loadouts are the fastest way to get your equipment together.

There are maps with tickets; do BA's use less tickets to spawn then, oh.. an assault, or is it all 1 ticket?
BA are worth 1 ticket, other assets are worth more, depending on their size. An Atlas is worth more tickets then a Owens.

Base turrets seem to give me zero chance, they never miss and are long range. (they can hit a BA but can't snipe a cockpit?) How long does it take them to respawn if I manage to remove one?
Many bases have ways that allow you to come close enough to capture without getting into the turrets line of sight.
You can also destroy them from far away with a AC2 and mPPC, they should only target you if you are closer then 300 or 400m.

Respawn takes quite some time, around 5 minutes I think.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Greeny on January 25, 2011, 05:10:30 AM
Thank you very much for the answers, it's a very big help.

I'm already formulating new strategies, since it's incredibly unforgiving, everything kills it easy like an afterthought, even the afterthought splash damage. 

Once I dropped all 8 of my grenades on a demolisher's head, stuck in a crevice. Didn't even kill it lol . I'm in the process of learning if it's a joke feature to this game.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Blu_Haze on January 25, 2011, 05:18:37 AM
Thank you very much for the answers, it's a very big help.

I'm already formulating new strategies, since it's incredibly unforgiving, everything kills it easy like an afterthought, even the afterthought splash damage. 

Once I dropped all 8 of my grenades on a demolisher's head, stuck in a crevice. Didn't even kill it lol . I'm in the process of learning if it's a joke feature to this game.

You probably tossed them onto the turret. The turret of a tank has by far the most armor of the entire vehicle, which was made that way since it can be hit from any side. The most effective way to kill a tank is to hit either the front, rear, or the side panels. Those four spots are all the lightest armored on the tank, and you only have to make one of them go critical to destroy the entire thing.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: AlfalphaCat on January 25, 2011, 05:48:29 AM
Thank you very much for the answers, it's a very big help.

I'm already formulating new strategies, since it's incredibly unforgiving, everything kills it easy like an afterthought, even the afterthought splash damage. 

Once I dropped all 8 of my grenades on a demolisher's head, stuck in a crevice. Didn't even kill it lol . I'm in the process of learning if it's a joke feature to this game.

You probably tossed them onto the turret. The turret of a tank has by far the most armor of the entire vehicle, which was made that way since it can be hit from any side. The most effective way to kill a tank is to hit either the front, rear, or the side panels. Those four spots are all the lightest armored on the tank, and you only have to make one of them go critical to destroy the entire thing.

From my experience they also stick better to the sides of a tank, flat surfaces are C8's friend.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Errodien Ward on January 27, 2011, 12:18:14 AM
Thank you very much for the answers, it's a very big help.

I'm already formulating new strategies, since it's incredibly unforgiving, everything kills it easy like an afterthought, even the afterthought splash damage. 

Once I dropped all 8 of my grenades on a demolisher's head, stuck in a crevice. Didn't even kill it lol . I'm in the process of learning if it's a joke feature to this game.

You probably tossed them onto the turret. The turret of a tank has by far the most armor of the entire vehicle, which was made that way since it can be hit from any side. The most effective way to kill a tank is to hit either the front, rear, or the side panels. Those four spots are all the lightest armored on the tank, and you only have to make one of them go critical to destroy the entire thing.

From my experience they also stick better to the sides of a tank, flat surfaces are C8's friend.

It seems that running in the same direction as your moving target seems tog et them to stick, though it may just be that I'm lucky with flat surfaces xD
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ^sPikE- on March 08, 2011, 03:59:56 AM
bump for great justice.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: delushin on March 08, 2011, 06:58:16 AM
Nice thread good job!

BA is something I have been playing around with a little and one tactic that has had some good success (when working with a team on TS) is using BA to sneak behind enemies and tag for long range friendlies to unload on ... works really well in a team of 5 ... 2x long range 2x brawlers / diversion 1x BA tagger its heaps of fun!
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ELH_Vivicector on March 08, 2011, 09:09:18 AM
If you can, shoot enemy's weapons! Missle boats without their LRM racks are no danger for your team. See that ArrowIV Catapult? Shoot Arrows' containers! They are rather fragile and they are the only weapon of that mech. Hollander with HGauss? You know what to do!
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Squibby on March 09, 2011, 09:42:39 AM
Eat hguass :D, damn BA...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: megab0t_5 on March 09, 2011, 09:57:45 AM
My MK II on Kago was raped so hard by a squad of BA, my monitor is still shaking even at the windows desktop. :(
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Snow Gibbon on March 09, 2011, 12:37:38 PM
Avoid using laser weaponry. It makes you a lot easier to spot.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Errodien Ward on March 09, 2011, 03:19:55 PM
Avoid using laser weaponry. It makes you a lot easier to spot.

... Or you could just not fire it at max range in an open area. it is best used up close when you are within about 50 meters of the mech/vehicle/whatever.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Vanion2 on May 04, 2011, 12:05:24 AM
I just read a ton of great advice and have a few things to add:

SRM's....use them.  If the mech is in radar range you can lock on in short order.  Even if they have LAMS the SRM's have a good chance to hit at close range.  If the mech is close enough, don't wait for the lock.  Fire away.

Fighting another BA and waiting for the mPPC to recharge?  SRM right where he is about to land for a nice round of splash damage and a direct hit is BA giblets.  (I am pretty sure you cannot lock onto a BA with SRM's though).  If you are really good (or really lucky) you can SRM BA's in the air but if you miss you don't get the splash damage effect so I prefer to use them pointed down.

Just keep in mind how close you are when firing the SRM's as the splash damage isn't picky. 

Unlike lasers the SMR's won't give you away if you are clever about it so take advantage.  I can usually fire the mPPC and the HML twice before the SRM's reload so just keep firing away until those two little missiles light up in your HUD.

Firing off an HML and want to cut it short?  Switch weapons.  Instantly kills the beam and is a great way to reduce visibility to the enemy. 

Reserve the HML for close range encounters.  Especially if you can land on the mech or have a good line on its back armor.  It's tempting to use every gun you have when in a fight but the HML is only effective at 175m or less and is a big yellow banner saying "BA here!".  Use it wisely and you will be well rewarded is many a mech kill.

You can carry quite a few of all three types of grenades.  Do so.  I usually get about 3-4 of the C8's and Infernos each.  I skip the narcs because I try not to get that close to a mech unless I am defending a base.  You can buy more if you run out but loading up is usually a waste as you will probably die before you get to use them all. 

You can throw grenades over walls.  If you have a pesky asset waiting to snipe you just around a wall start tossing a few to piss them off at the least.  At the best you could score a kill (I've done it before).

If you see any asset with a flamer get the hell out of there.  If you even sense a Huit get the hell out of there.  Lure them into traps but don't try to take them on unless there are several talented BA's working together. 

Remember...your #1 job is to piss off the enemy.  Let them call you cowards and tell you to come out and fight all they want.  Play smart and keep picking at them.  Let your team know where they are and what's going on and you will be doing your job.  I never score the highest when I am a dedicated BA but I score pretty damn good when I play my part and my k/d ratio may not be great but if I am close to even at the end of a round I am pretty damn happy with myself.   :D
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Brainwright on May 05, 2011, 07:54:19 AM
The BA AC2 does more damage over a given period of time than the Micro Heavy Laser, but only at < 50m.  This is best used while defending bases as you can generally approach your target more easily.

The damage you can do is not to be underestimated.  I, personally, can come close to taking arms off of raiding lights trying to cap a seemingly undefended base, all before I have to let the thing cool down.  The trick is to approach from above, where they can't pan to shoot you.  Never fly in their face, and never stay at their feet for long, as it's all easy pickings for someone who knows how to shoot.  If they start to move away, fall back and keep picking at them until they get the point.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ^sPikE- on May 08, 2011, 04:51:19 PM
Got stickied!  8)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ELH_Vivicector on May 09, 2011, 07:41:11 AM
/Based on some recent experience as a driver of 4*RAC2 Parti/

Dear BA player, if you see enemy partisan of huit near you - RUN.  Do not stand still and hope, that he won't pay attention to you. Do not try to shoot it. just RUNRUNRUN! The same goes for Mr. Bubbles, Bushwacker A, other things... You can attack them only if they are fighting with some else.

Remember, that Vulture B is a dangerous thing for you. NEVER... NEVER land on the ground, where it can shoot you. SSRMs' splash will tear you apart. However, poptarting against it is rather safe. Same goes for units with MRMs.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Warhammer WHM-6R on May 09, 2011, 03:18:28 PM
/Based on some recent experience as a driver of 4*RAC2 Parti/

Dear BA player, if you see enemy partisan of huit near you - RUN.  Do not stand still and hope, that he won't pay attention to you. Do not try to shoot it. just RUNRUNRUN! The same goes for Mr. Bubbles, Bushwacker A, other things... You can attack them only if they are fighting with some else.

Remember, that Vulture B is a dangerous thing for you. NEVER... NEVER land on the ground, where it can shoot you. SSRMs' splash will tear you apart. However, poptarting against it is rather safe. Same goes for units with MRMs.

+1

Dear BA Player,
I am the Huit Prime and even if I am engaging another asset I will not hesitate to take the 2 seconds needed to grab a free kill. If a I or any of the partyvans are within 1500-800m then I would advise you to find something else to do or some other objective to go after. I have been known to leave enemy APCs on the field because it just generates a steady stream of light snacks. Nothing personal but I do also chuckle when I see an ejecting player or the teltale BA JJ trail.

Yours truly,
Huit Prime
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [CoffiNail] on May 10, 2011, 02:34:12 PM
One thing to keep in consideration as a BA is running.  Jump jets are awesome but I have survived during the middle of fire fights quite often by mostly running along the ground.  With a lot of action going on a lot of people will ignore you, or even notice you. One of the prime factors in letting people know a BA is kicking around is the plumes of smoke that come from a BA's JJ.  As mentioned above me by Warhammer, you see a Huit, just go, run, hide.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Errodien Ward on May 13, 2011, 04:29:42 AM
/Based on some recent experience as a driver of 4*RAC2 Parti/

Dear BA player, if you see enemy partisan of huit near you - RUN.  Do not stand still and hope, that he won't pay attention to you. Do not try to shoot it. just RUNRUNRUN! The same goes for Mr. Bubbles, Bushwacker A, other things... You can attack them only if they are fighting with some else.

Remember, that Vulture B is a dangerous thing for you. NEVER... NEVER land on the ground, where it can shoot you. SSRMs' splash will tear you apart. However, poptarting against it is rather safe. Same goes for units with MRMs.

+1

Dear BA Player,
I am the Huit Prime and even if I am engaging another asset I will not hesitate to take the 2 seconds needed to grab a free kill. If a I or any of the partyvans are within 1500-800m then I would advise you to find something else to do or some other objective to go after. I have been known to leave enemy APCs on the field because it just generates a steady stream of light snacks. Nothing personal but I do also chuckle when I see an ejecting player or the teltale BA JJ trail.

Yours truly,
Huit Prime

Dear Huit Prime,

Sorry for getting up close to give you that hug, I figure you didn't like it much with all the useless shooting and such. Nothing personal, but I just love getting in close enough so that you cannot shoot me. Your tears are wonderful lubricants for my Battle Armor joints.

Truly your,
Smart Battle Armor
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Brainwright on May 13, 2011, 04:37:55 AM
Dear Huit Prime,

Sorry for getting up close to give you that hug, I figure you didn't like it much with all the useless shooting and such. Nothing personal, but I just love getting in close enough so that you cannot shoot me. Your tears are wonderful lubricants for my Battle Armor joints.

Truly your,
Smart Battle Armor

Explanation is necessary.

If you can get within 5m of a tank, you're generally below the point where its turret can follow you.  Take advantage by planting grenades and wailing away with an AC2.  Be careful, though, because it can easily get far enough away to shoot you or just plain run you over.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Warhammer WHM-6R on May 19, 2011, 12:28:35 PM
Dear Smart Battle Armor,
If I have let you cross the one thousand four hundred and ninety five meters of my effective range (of which a good five hundred plus fully detectable with my bloodhound active probe) without molesting you and you have been able to avoid my whole team amongst whom I should be standing then I will dub you not a smart battle armor but a flipping ninja battle armor. Do though still beware my worthy foe because I am a tricky one and do still have an ace up my sleeve in the form of a turbo boost. This turbo boost is a Clan tech monster which can compress 42 m3 of air per second in full swing and if you are caught in front of me then all your stealth will not stop you from being sucked into my fusion powerhouse as I surge over your soon to be sneaky corpse.

Kind regards,
Huit Prime

[edit]: tiny correction. Thanks Siege
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CHH Siege on May 20, 2011, 09:36:39 AM
Dear Smart Battle Armor,
If I have let you cross the one thousand four hundred and ninety five meters of my effective range (of which a good five hundred plus fully detectable with my bloodhound active probe) without molesting you and you have been able to avoid my whole team amongst whom I should be standing then I will dub you not a smart battle armor but a flipping ninja battle armor. Do though still beware my worthy foe because I am a tricky one and do still have an ace up my sleeve in the form of a turbo boost. This turbo boost is a Clan tech monster which can compress 42 m2 of air per second in full swing and if you are caught in front of me then all your stealth will not stop you from being sucked into my fusion powerhouse as I surge over your soon to be sneaky corpse.

Kind regards,
Huit Prime

+10^123 (ala the Shannon Number) QFT; this is the best thing I have read in this thread.

Slight correction for you though, that should be m not m.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Warhammer WHM-6R on May 24, 2011, 09:58:32 AM
Aaarrrrrggghh!! Epic post fail!

Thank you for catching me siege ;D
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Glycerin on June 08, 2011, 06:21:41 PM
great thread!
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Gremlich on July 04, 2011, 10:54:54 PM
why is the TAG range so limited, while 2K meters may be more realistic, how about 800-1000m?
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Eviticus on July 05, 2011, 12:43:21 AM
I kinda hope TAG range is reduced to 1meter, so either it stops getting used or the BA's who use it die soon after. You know, that or someone who actually knows how to use it grabs it.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Tripod on July 05, 2011, 01:35:19 AM
for BA vs BA fighting, never use missiles unless you're sure you'll hit

Their splash has been heavily reduced and they are basically a waste of time unless you're 3 meters away from your target and they're on the ground.
Better to just fire your laser instead
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Errodien Ward on July 05, 2011, 04:05:29 AM
for BA vs BA fighting, never use missiles unless you're sure you'll hit

Their splash has been heavily reduced and they are basically a waste of time unless you're 3 meters away from your target and they're on the ground.
Better to just fire your laser instead

Are you sure? I have yet to notice any difference with the SRM's this patch, except for the ganking that they randomly do to you every once and a while
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Tripod on July 05, 2011, 04:23:37 AM
AFAIK, back in 0.3.2 BA vs BA fights basically ended as soon as one BA hit the ground while another had their SSRMs out and ready to fire

Now even landing a hit as little as 1.5 meters away will result in NO damage (before missing by 2 meters = kill)
I generally just keep firing my red laser rather than waste time switching weps and shooting

Landing one well still gives you an instant kill, but they seem really twitchy and are only reliable at near point-blank ranges
The whole "explode in the tube" thing doesn't help them much either :-\
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ^sPikE- on July 06, 2011, 06:18:39 PM
they might behave a bit erraticaly, but its still better imo to shoot laser+rockets+laser, shooting rockets when the enemy falls to the ground. im certain i killed plenty other BAs with missiles since 0.5
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [CoffiNail] on July 07, 2011, 12:55:56 AM
oh you kill them, the splash just seems reduced... after a match a bunch of us strarted a big TK 0cbill BA Brawl. SRMs were rather hard to get a kill with.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 11, 2011, 03:53:30 AM
I play BA about 50% of the time (the other 50% split evenly between mechs and tanks)

A few things to add...

1) Be careful when using the TAG laser on night maps as the enemy can see the beam if they have IF-vision turned on.

2) Be careful that you know what mechs you're up against. If you see a Hollander firing an AC at somebody beware! Its either the HollanderII B with its 4 flamers or the HollanderII C with its RAC-5 and 2xUAC-2's, both good at BA killing!

3) NEVER use your full boost when in the midst of battle. If an enemy is looking at you as you near the top of your jump, use your remaining JJ juice to make a quick burst sideways to dodge the inevitable attack. Remember that if you are airborne with no JJ's then you follow a predictable (and slow) falling arc to the ground.

4) On rare occasions, the drop weapon key can be very useful. The other day I was playing a game as BA. I was using the mPPC and the AC2. A friendly pilot ejected near me after an LRM salvo crippled his mech. I called him over into cover next to me and gave him my mPPC. The AC2 can be used to snipe is short bursts and is a great close combat weapon (with a 5-second full auto and only 3-second reload, enough to launch 2 SRMs), so my effectiveness was not reduced much while his increased considerably. The two of us went on to kill 2 enemy mechs including the LRM boat that had ravaged him earlier.

5) Don't shoot at Aero's with laser weapons. It gives your possition away. DO shoot at them with the AC-2 though.

6) Setup some loadouts to buy a full set of C8 and other explosives. This saves critical time at the APC when you spawn.

7) Try not to go in a straight line from the APC to the fight. Even zig-zagging a little will help prevent your APC from being found.

8) APCs are great to hide underwater on certain maps. If completely submerged it is increadibly hard to spot.

9) Getting behind the enemy lines and picking off their wounded mechs as they RTB for repairs = smart

10) Staying on the same hill after killing a returning mech = dumb. They will come and find you when they respawn...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Tripod on October 11, 2011, 04:00:38 AM
I play BA about 50% of the time (the other 50% split evenly between mechs and tanks)

A few things to add...

4) On rare occasions, the drop weapon key can be very useful. The other day I was playing a game as BA. I was using the mPPC and the AC2. A friendly pilot ejected near me after an LRM salvo crippled his mech. I called him over into cover next to me and gave him my mPPC. The AC2 can be used to snipe is short bursts and is a great close combat weapon (with a 5-second full auto and only 3-second reload, enough to launch 2 SRMs), so my effectiveness was not reduced much while his increased considerably. The two of us went on to kill 2 enemy mechs including the LRM boat that had ravaged him earlier.

5) Don't shoot at Aero's with laser weapons. It gives your possition away. DO shoot at them with the AC-2 though.

4) If you're lucky enough to hit an enemy BA with a thrown weapon you might kill them for epic lols

5) They both give your position away but lasers can actually hit air well, so I don't get it
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 11, 2011, 04:24:51 AM
I play BA about 50% of the time (the other 50% split evenly between mechs and tanks)
5) Don't shoot at Aero's with laser weapons. It gives your possition away. DO shoot at them with the AC-2 though.
5) They both give your position away but lasers can actually hit air well, so I don't get it

A beam of light going straight up in the air for a few seconds or a couple of muzzle flashes (and maybe a smoke trail, not sure if there even is one though)

Either way I would think that a red/green line leading straight to you is easier to spot than a few muzzle flashes in the distance...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Tripod on October 11, 2011, 05:24:10 AM
You don't see the massive trail of tracers?

Or do they not appear on low settings ??? (assuming you're on low settings)

Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 11, 2011, 08:34:53 AM
My settings are a mix of normal and low, so maybe they don't show up for me... I don't recall ever seeing trails from the AC-2 rounds...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: DFDelta on October 11, 2011, 01:29:54 PM
I've never seen them either, and I'm playing on CCC lvl 3. And I think I've never seen enyone who seems to have taken note on mine.
I often sit on a hill plinking at enemy mechs from 600 meters out, and I've never seen anybody turning to see where they come from. Only my target seems to notice when he gets annoyed by the red "incoming damage" arrows pointing everywhere.  ;D
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Knightcrawler on October 13, 2011, 08:57:30 AM
2) Despite what somebody said earlier in this thread ::) don't attack a Hollander sporting a HGauss. It's other weapons are all flamers...

Despite what Blackthorne said, DO attack HGauss Hollanders because flamers on a Hollander are only dangerous if there is a parti also trying to gun you down.

5) Don't shoot at Aero's with laser weapons. It gives your possition away. DO shoot at them with the AC-2 though.

Yeah, it gives your position away. It also hurts them a lot if you do it right, and you can save a team mate's life. Being stealthy is important, but don't be a weenie. :-P I'd say with small lasers, there's less reward for it because it doesn't do nearly as much damage and you have to fire a lot. So maybe not with that, but if it gets in range of your death piss beam, go for it as long as you are aware you'll have to hide from sight a bit more (which doesn't mean standing still or camping; quite the opposite).

8) APCs are great to hide underwater on certain maps. If completely submerged it is increadibly hard to spot.

The higher the graphics setting, the clearer the water. So while harder, it's not incredibly harder. Now someone on low settings will just see a giant glowing blue lake...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [CoffiNail] on October 13, 2011, 05:11:41 PM
want to have some fun? Grab a Heavy laser and keep your small laser. Pop them a good bit with the small laser until they go close and surprised I am not an ejected pilot but a dedi BA!
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 13, 2011, 05:17:03 PM
The higher the graphics setting, the clearer the water. So while harder, it's not incredibly harder. Now someone on low settings will just see a giant glowing blue lake...

I'm going to make a poll now to see how many players play on each graphics setting. I've hidden an APC in a river outside an enemy base before and it has lasted all game (even though the enemy walked by it on a number of occasions). We got so much Elemental raping done the Inner Sphere my have been sore for a week ;D

want to have some fun? Grab a Heavy laser and keep your small laser. Pop them a good bit with the small laser until they go close and surprised I am not an ejected pilot but a dedi BA!

A lot of people underestimate the BA SBL... It's got decent range at 300m and does a good bit of damage if you fire it regularly (and you are accurate).
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [CoffiNail] on October 13, 2011, 05:19:41 PM
PPLUS it has a real fast recycle time. I actualy love to use it to take out base defenses tbh as it does not recoil you halfway across a roof and off it when the SBL is fired.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: DFDelta on October 13, 2011, 08:40:05 PM
I actually prefer the SBL over the mHL most of the time.

Its not as obvious (everyone recognizes the uber-piss-beam-of-doooooooom from 2 miles out, but a small laser is just a small laser), the range is a huge advantage, and the damage is not half bad (3rd best BA weapon in terms of dps).

AC2/SBL is my currently most used combination, followed by AC2/mPPC.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 13, 2011, 09:58:04 PM
The mPPC is useful for things besides sniping though, so it makes for a very flexible weapon. I usually will take the mPPC plus one of the lasers (MHL or SBL).

I tried using the AC2 for sniping the other day, but it's more of an annoyance than an actual threat (even for light mechs) at that kind of range... I've kind of gone off of it recently for this reason...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [CoffiNail] on October 13, 2011, 10:07:38 PM
I tend to use the AC as a harassing weapon more than for damage. Ifthey have a lot of campers with LRMS and such run along their sidelines, out of sight 600m back and pop off a few ac2 shots, stop and observe. That crouched LRM owens is now standing up going oh shit what hit me?
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 13, 2011, 10:12:47 PM
I tend to use the AC as a harassing weapon more than for damage. Ifthey have a lot of campers with LRMS and such run along their sidelines, out of sight 600m back and pop off a few ac2 shots, stop and observe. That crouched LRM owens is now standing up going oh shit what hit me?

+1 because this has been done to me when I was LRM camping before.

So in short (for those of you trying to use this guide as a guide), if you use the AC-2 as a damage deaing weapon (from more than 80m from your target) then you are trying too hard and missing the point.

Of course, within 80m your shots do full damage and you are close enough to go full auto, so feel free to eat up some Inner Sphere Ferro Fibrous ;D
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Tripod on October 13, 2011, 10:38:43 PM
I generally use small laser as a utility weapon and MHL for BA killer + crazy in-close damage

Buying only one BA weapon also lets you send more cash to teamies
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 14, 2011, 06:17:59 AM
I generally use small laser as a utility weapon and MHL for BA killer + crazy in-close damage

Buying only one BA weapon also lets you send more cash to teamies

True, but the 5500 credits you save from not buying an mPPC is fairly minimal in my book. Especially later in the game when you've ranked up. I was playing BA the other night and sending 50k or more to my teammates when I died because of my rank...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: ELH_Vivicector on October 14, 2011, 04:17:15 PM
Weapon config? mPPC+MHBL is the classic one, but I like mPPC+AC2 more. With both weapons I can snipe from the range, but the best part of it is incredible damage from AC2 in close. Getting in full auto distance can be hard, but very rewarding. 
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: AlfalphaCat on October 14, 2011, 10:14:19 PM
Uhh, guys, the HGauss Holly doesn't have flamers, that is the UAC20 one that has them.  It has four small beams, which aren't the greatest for killing BA.   ;)
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: CGB [Blackthorne] on October 15, 2011, 06:10:57 AM
Uhh, guys, the HGauss Holly doesn't have flamers, that is the UAC20 one that has them.  It has four small beams, which aren't the greatest for killing BA.   ;)

Oops, I think that was my bad... let me go check if my post needs fixing...

Also, best BA advice ever, don't be afraid to die! If you have fear, you will hesitate. If you hesitate, you will die. Charging in to the face of death will keep you alive more often than if you pussyfoot around during your attack. A tenacious BA wins the day! Believe it!
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Knightcrawler on October 15, 2011, 10:24:50 AM
I was uh... just being polite? :) Anyway, message to Hollander pilots facing off against good BA: Look at your radar, find a friend, turn in that direction, and high tail it.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Squibby on October 17, 2011, 11:23:42 PM
Eh, an Hgauss to the face usually sorts out that little issue...
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Knightcrawler on November 02, 2011, 03:12:30 PM
As BA, dumbfire SSRMs if you know you have a good chance of hitting. Less time waiting means more time hiding/dodging/shooting/throwing, and it also seems to slip through LAMS quite often. Remember they are kinda like MRMs and can be guided after their initial flight.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Flametrace on March 19, 2012, 05:37:16 PM
A post I made from another thread. These aren't the best tips, but they'll sure help keep you alive and dealing damage.
"Some BA tips:

1.As a BA in maps such as swamp with cover in relatively shallow water with seaweed in it, fly up out of the water, shoot, and fall back in to be more effective at fighting larger enemies. I nearly soloed an un-damaged Warhammer doing this when I was really new to the game.
 
2. On a low gravity map such as extremity, try to fly a little way above your enemy's head and bombard them with grenades and rockets, just make sure you have enough jet fuel to fly away so you don't go down too.

3. When on a low gravity map, make use of turning direction mid air to keep changing directions to confuse your enemy and get more damage dealt before you die.

4. When playing as a BA and you have a base/group of allies about to be attacked, you can confuse your enemies by crouching on top of a steep hill with a PPC to use the knockback to fall off and recharge before you fly up again. This is a great way to deal decent damage and get points while keeping yourself alive for as long as you can.

5. If you know you're going to die to an enemy, make suicide run using PPCs, grenades, rockets, and heavy lasers to deal as much damage as you can to them before you die. (If you don't die the first run, you may be able to make several more and destroy even heavy mechs with slow rate of fire weapons.

6. When I'm piloting a vehicle, I like to jump out and fly up right as I get hit by an explosive weapon when I'm about to die. Sometimes enemies will mistake you for a flying piece of debris, allowing you to get in a few last shots.

7. If you are extremely careful, you may be able to destroy a lone assault mech by getting on it's shoulders and shooting it with something like a heavy laser. Be careful, though, I've been blown up by my allies doing this. And if you somehow crit the mech when you run out of jetpack power, you're pretty much toast."
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Brainwright on March 20, 2012, 02:56:58 PM
Real men use an AC2, just sayin'.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: Ressk [CSF] on March 20, 2012, 09:54:27 PM
Real men use an AC2, just sayin'.

real men use the BA RAC and the narc grenades. just saying.
Title: Re: Guide to Elemental/BA
Post by: =KoS= Tripod on March 20, 2012, 11:27:19 PM
real men go in with no weapons at all and land on the enemy's cockpit and hump it until the mech wanders out of bounds. just sayin'